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General Category => Off Topic => Topic started by: DarkZephyr on June 05, 2019, 08:13:41 am

Title: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 05, 2019, 08:13:41 am
I'm starting this thread so that I can finish a conversation I was having with Highwayman667 and DarkProphet while respecting Wesp's wishes that the Bloodlines 2 link thread remains on topic.  But I figure we can throw in conversation about other aspects of Fantasy gaming and lore as well if anyone has the urge to chat about it. 
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I didn't find Merill to be all that attractive whatsoever (though Fenris was), but no, I wasn't referencing the elves of Dragon Age 2 (DA elves look 100% better in Dragon Age Inquisition, in my opinion), I was referencing the elves of Skyrim. You have your reasons for feeling the way that you do.  I have my reasons for feeling the way that I do.  I don't understand why you feel the need to call those who see it differently than yourself "silly" or to imply that we are "closed minded".

Well... you did refer to the DA2 elf design as "dog sh*t"... xD

I apologize if my words came off as offensive in any way. I just find it a bit exaggerated when people say the elves in Dragon Age 2 looked like "dog sh*t" when it was a clear effort from the designers to create something more original and authentic than what we usually see, and that earns some merit to me because if it was up to a lot of people (maybe not you, but others) then every videogame character would look like a supermodel.

And your comment about their beauty making them alien proves my point.  They don't have to be ugly to be alien.  Thank you for that, that is exactly what I was saying.

Sure but just because somebody chooses to do something different doesn't mean it's... doggy poo !

I was definitely thinking of the Skyrim elves in my head when I said that.  lol   

Thanks for the apology, I wasn't offended, just curious.  lol

I make absolutely NO apologies for preferring the 65 year old quite traditional and not at all "new" or "modern" approach to Fantasy elves. 

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/N/A/7zNAA/Elves-Legolas-Arwen-Galadriel-Elrdon-Thandruil_l.jpg)

First, I like that you bring up those portrayals, because the idea behind those designs was to at least try to separate the elves from what humans and dwarfs regularly look like. NO ONE that was human in the LOTR trilogy looked like that, because the whole point about making the elves alien and strange was to make them SO BEAUTIFUL that they might as well be something completely different. Sure, they're pretty, but you can't think of those examples as anything remotely similar to this:

(https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/eldragonverde/images/b/b3/Boromir.png/revision/latest?cb=20121221142047&path-prefix=es) (https://a1cf74336522e87f135f-2f21ace9a6cf0052456644b80fa06d4f.ssl.cf2.rackcdn.com/images/characters/p-the-lord-of-the-rings-john-rhys-davies.jpg) (https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f3/8f/f0/f38ff01fde4f248cba48524e929f59a1.jpg)

Second of all... what do you mean by "dog sh*t" ? You mean like this ?

(https://monovicioso.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/merrill-da2.png)

I don't think it's a modern approach and it's not a particularly bad one either. Not everyone can be aesthetically beautiful because such a thing is not real in any way, shape or form when it comes to actual reality. It's a silly notion to pretend that elves or humans or any other kind of creature should obligatorily be an object of desire and admiration; if the former was the case, then what would have Jack from BL1 looked like ? What would Bertram Tung ? What would any character if the "correct" standard was for beauty to be prioritized ? And who's to say many of the elves from DA2 weren't beautiful as Good old Merrill was ? Open thy mind, people !

I didn't find Merill to be all that attractive whatsoever (though Fenris was), but no, I wasn't referencing the elves of Dragon Age 2 (DA elves look 100% better in Dragon Age Inquisition, in my opinion), I was referencing the elves of Skyrim.

You have your reasons for feeling the way that you do.  I have my reasons for feeling the way that I do.  I don't understand why you feel the need to call those who see it differently than yourself "silly" or to imply that we are "closed minded". 

And your comment about their beauty making them alien proves my point.  They don't have to be ugly to be alien.  Thank you for that, that is exactly what I was saying. 

I don't want every single race in my RPGs to be beautiful, nor do I need every member of the beautiful races to be beautiful nor have I stated anything of the kind.  But I prefer it when elves are among the pretty races.  ESPECIALLY when the lore CLAIMS they are beautiful, like it does in both Elder Scrolls lore AND Dragon Age lore. That's just how I feel.  Again, I won't apologize for that. 

As for your comparisons of LOTR elves with the other LOTR races, let me just say that I thought several of the humans in the series were gorgeous. 

What's so "not beautiful" about them?  The fact that they have beards?  That doesn't make them "not beautiful" in my eyes, but if you DID shave them and slap pointy ears on them, they would fit right in with the elves, as far as I am concerned.
(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/P/q/7zPqb/image.jpg)(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/P/p/7zPpL/Faramir-faramir-9716911-1024-768_l.jpg)

To be fair, "teh gayness" might've interfered with your appreciation of Merrill's looks. I liked her accent and romanced her because she wasn't a whore, but she was kinda weird and I didn't like her a ton. Gimme some Morrigan. Shady, cougar-y, cool accent, and she wants muh destiny babies.

Well, I do think that I can tell when a female is attractive, I thought Merril was pretty in Dragon Age Origins when she was depicted in the Dalish Origin. 

That was weird.  They COMPLETELY revamped her whole personality for the sequel.  Sort of similar to what they did to Anders.

I loved Morrigan.  Of the straight romances, she was my favorite. 
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on June 05, 2019, 10:33:45 am
For me, before the LOTR movies, fantasy where these games:

(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/399240-sacred-gold-windows-front-cover.jpg)

(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/91989-gothic-ii-windows-front-cover.jpg)

(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/344833-arcanum-of-steamworks-magick-obscura-windows-manual.jpg)

Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on June 05, 2019, 10:45:14 am
Plus I suggest these amazing animated movies:

(http://cdn1.nflximg.net/images/2685/12862685.jpg)

(https://walter.trakt.tv/images/shows/000/000/271/posters/thumb/5a1943ce6a.jpg)
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 05, 2019, 11:15:10 am
Very cool!  My very early encounters with PC Fantasy (and horror) gaming came from these games: 

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/9/7zS9P/165121-american-mcgee-s-alice-windows-front-cover_l.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/8/7zS8K/12306-clive-barker-s-undying-windows-front-cover_l.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/8/7zS8I/5546-2.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/9/7zS9W/2360279-baldur.png.jpg)



(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/9/7zS9X/5283199.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/8/7zS8J/13010_front.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/8/7zS8M/77476-neverwinter-nights-windows-front-cover_l.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/8/7zS8N/77483-neverwinter-nights-hordes-of-the-underdark-windows-front-cover_l.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/8/7zS8L/8645-the-wheel-of-time-windows-front-cover_l.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/a/7zSac/260495-dungeon-keeper-2-windows-front-cover_l.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/a/7zSal/454646-fable-the-lost-chapters-xbox-front-cover_l.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/S/e/7zSez/36057-the-elder-scrolls-iii-morrowind-game-of-the-year-edition-windows-front-cover_l.jpg)
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on June 05, 2019, 12:44:34 pm
Played Neverwinter Nights and hated it up to the end (specially the soundtrack)
Played Fable (TLC) and loved every single moment (specially the Greatwood score)
Tried Morrowind and Oblivion, both never continued after the first five minutes
:razz:

Anyway, Wheel Of Time seems promising, I'll search it
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 05, 2019, 01:02:24 pm
Played Neverwinter Nights and hated it up to the end (specially the soundtrack)
Played Fable (TLC) and loved every single moment (specially the Greatwood score)
Tried Morrowind and Oblivion, both never continued after the first five minutes
:razz:

Anyway, Wheel Of Time seems promising, I'll search it

I loved all of those games.

I haven't been able to get Wheel of Time to work since I had a Windows XP computer, so I don't know if there is a way to get it to work on more modern machines.   People are trying to get GOG to pick it up.  That would be very awesome.  I would love to play it again. 
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on June 05, 2019, 05:21:59 pm
Simple method to play old games: pick your windows pc, sterilize it from windows, install linux and in it wine (the windows os emulator for linus also known as "Wine Is Not an Emulator")
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Happydeathclaw on June 05, 2019, 07:55:10 pm


I haven't been able to get Wheel of Time to work since I had a Windows XP computer, so I don't know if there is a way to get it to work on more modern machines.   People are trying to get GOG to pick it up.  That would be very awesome.  I would love to play it again.

It's possible after some shaman dancing around the game https://www.speedrun.com/wot/guide/6eulv
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkProphet on June 05, 2019, 08:17:10 pm
For me, before the LOTR movies, fantasy where these games:

(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/399240-sacred-gold-windows-front-cover.jpg)

(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/91989-gothic-ii-windows-front-cover.jpg)

(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/344833-arcanum-of-steamworks-magick-obscura-windows-manual.jpg)

Wow, the Sacred cover art in other countries was weird. That looks NOTHING like the angel girl (whatever she's called). IN America, it's just a white box with some funky symbol that kinda looks like an orgy of all the different characters' weapons smooshed together.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on June 05, 2019, 10:16:34 pm
Being this game distributed by different local publishers each choosed or commissioned different artworks.
The one I picked is the one by FX Interactive (a small publisher active in Italy and Spain) because being the one I grown with it will have always a special place in my heart <3
But honestly there are a few other really interesting:

Germany (the original one)
(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/30834-sacred-windows-front-cover.jpg)

UK
(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/37069-sacred-windows-front-cover.jpg)

France
(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/236856-sacred-gold-windows-front-cover.jpg)

three different from Russia
(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/117857-sacred-windows-front-cover.jpg)

(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/134736-sacred-underworld-windows-front-cover.jpg)

(https://www.mobygames.com/images/covers/l/117866-sacred-gold-windows-front-cover.jpg)

The one you talked about I suspect it's the sacred weapon (more like a magical amulet than a conventional weapon) in the game
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 05, 2019, 11:20:55 pm


I haven't been able to get Wheel of Time to work since I had a Windows XP computer, so I don't know if there is a way to get it to work on more modern machines.   People are trying to get GOG to pick it up.  That would be very awesome.  I would love to play it again.

It's possible after some shaman dancing around the game https://www.speedrun.com/wot/guide/6eulv

Hey thanks!  I will give this a shot!  Also gives us the game free, I see.  Very awesome. 
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 06, 2019, 01:10:44 am
To be fair, "teh gayness" might've interfered with your appreciation of Merrill's looks. I liked her accent and romanced her because she wasn't a whore, but she was kinda weird and I didn't like her a ton. Gimme some Morrigan. Shady, cougar-y, cool accent, and she wants muh destiny babies.

"teh gayness". What is this fucking 4chan ? xD

And what's that about "she wasn't a whore" ?
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 07, 2019, 07:05:43 pm
"teh gayness". What is this fucking 4chan ? xD

I just took it to mean that he can tell that I'm super cool! 

(https://media.giphy.com/media/kdEO6Rh8ybP4C63K7C/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 08, 2019, 03:11:45 am
"teh gayness". What is this fucking 4chan ? xD

I just took it to mean that he can tell that I'm super cool! 

(https://media.giphy.com/media/kdEO6Rh8ybP4C63K7C/giphy.gif)

Well, YOU ARE pretty cool for a ventrue >;D !
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 05:59:00 am
"teh gayness". What is this fucking 4chan ? xD

I just took it to mean that he can tell that I'm super cool! 

(https://media.giphy.com/media/kdEO6Rh8ybP4C63K7C/giphy.gif)

Well, YOU ARE pretty cool for a ventrue >;D !

That I am, as well as strikingly good looking.  One does not need to be a Toreador to be beautiful, after all.

(https://media.giphy.com/media/WpBc9pkdFyDp0bHQ3i/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on June 08, 2019, 07:44:46 am
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a1/9c/20/a19c20cacb61823a2982981486b0eb4a.jpg)
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 08:02:18 am
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a1/9c/20/a19c20cacb61823a2982981486b0eb4a.jpg)

Stunning!
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 12, 2019, 12:08:20 am
That cute little Mass Effect easter egg aside, the Thedas of Dragon Age is not a planet.  Thedas is ON a planet, naturally.  Its not a planet itself.  Its a continent.  As for the planet that Thedas is on, its a planet with magic, the fade and spirits. It was once utterly encompassed by The Fade.

I will say that if I am pissed at anything, is if The Maker is real and turns out to be an actual god.

I always thought the worst part in Origins was discovering that the Urn of Sacred Ashes was actually an urn with healing powers. What a bunch of shit. Not even the original legend it was based upon even worked like that.

Its because of the high concentration of Lyrium under the temple and not because of the Maker.  It even effects Leliana if she is killed there in your DAO playthrough and this is revealed in Dragon Age Inquisition. 

That being said, why would it piss you off so much if the Maker is real?

As for the original legend it was based on, I assume you mean the Holy Grail?

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/80/Chalice_of_Valencia.JPG/800px-Chalice_of_Valencia.JPG)
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 12, 2019, 04:26:26 am
Its because of the high concentration of Lyrium under the temple and not because of the Maker.  It even effects Leliana if she is killed there in your DOA playthrough and this is revealed in Dragon Age Inquisition.

I'm not sure that link was entirely confirmed in DAO. For all intents and purposes you just see the ashes cure Arl Eamon. And yes, I was indeed talking about thy Holy Grail.

That being said, why would it piss you off so much if the Maker is real?

This is an interesting question for me, and one I might just have to answer from a completely subjective point of view. On one hand, I wouldn't like it if The Maker was real because I don't believe I'm in kindergarten anymore, I find it silly to think about the idea of god existing even in a setting where elves and magic are perfectly real.

On the other hand, the only thing I probably dislike about the Dragon Age series is the religious apologism the writers sometimes indulge in. "The Chantry is necessary", "The Chantry keeps the peace", "The Chantry guards and protects Thedas".

Sure, they try to balance it out with other perspectives... but I find more often than not that they fail.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 12, 2019, 06:01:41 am
Its because of the high concentration of Lyrium under the temple and not because of the Maker.  It even effects Leliana if she is killed there in your DOA playthrough and this is revealed in Dragon Age Inquisition.

I'm not sure that link was entirely confirmed in DAO. For all intents and purposes you just see the ashes cure Arl Eamon. And yes, I was indeed talking about thy Holy Grail.

Well it becomes a bit clearer in DAI if Leliana died in DAO.  Its related to how the hell she can be alive in DAI if she died in DAO and ultimately what that means for her and her existence. 


That being said, why would it piss you off so much if the Maker is real?

This is an interesting question for me, and one I might just have to answer from a completely subjective point of view. On one hand, I wouldn't like it if The Maker was real because I don't believe I'm in kindergarten anymore, I find it silly to think about the idea of god existing even in a setting where elves and magic are perfectly real.

On the other hand, the only thing I probably dislike about the Dragon Age series is the religious apologism the writers sometimes indulge in. "The Chantry is necessary", "The Chantry keeps the peace", "The Chantry guards and protects Thedas".

Sure, they try to balance it out with other perspectives... but I find more often than not that they fail.

Well, their lore is their lore.  Personally, I try not to allow my own real life personal beliefs and agnosticism to affect my rage level directed at fictional fantasy video games.  I am no believer but I love the fictional gods of my favorite fantasy settings, such as TES and Forgotten Realms.  I find them to be much more enjoyable than what we get with Dragon Age.  I'm a big fan of Sheogorath, Azura, Mystra and Elistraee.  So if the Maker turned out to be real and it was DONE well, preferably in a way that rocks the chantry to the core, I would be very pleased.

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/B/K/b/7BKba/AJM4FB7d_400x400.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/B/K/j/7BKja/Azura.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/B/K/h/7BKhk/Mystra2.jpg)

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/B/K/f/7BKfS/Elistraee.jpg)
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on June 12, 2019, 08:16:33 am
Well, I don't mind deitiies in fantasy lore, specially if there are also demented ones just for the lols. As well as the options for atheists, agnostics, new ageish, freedom to mash things up or creating your own cult (the latter even for just profit)
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 12, 2019, 09:24:29 am
Well, I don't mind deitiies in fantasy lore, specially if there are also demented ones just for the lols. As well as the options for atheists, agnostics, new ageish, freedom to mash things up or creating your own cult (the latter even for just profit)

I don't feel the need to BE an atheist or an agnostic in a video game, but if that option is available for others, that's fine.  I actually like games that allow my character to apotheosize or "ascend" to godhood.  You get this to varying degrees with games like TES III: Morrowind, TES IV: Oblivion (Knights of the Nine, Shivering Isles), Jade Empire and Baldur's Gate II (Throne of Bhaal).  I very much enjoy it.   

Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on June 12, 2019, 09:11:51 pm
I loved how in Gothic II (I know I've already said that but whatever, sue me) most of the NPCs (specially many opposing you both as enemies and simple assholes you have to deal with) are religious fanaticals. And in the end you and
Xardas, your "mentor", prevail agaist all of them despite not giving a fuck about the gods on their or your side. So, as I felt it, it's wasn't about ascending to the level of gods for achieving godhood but to spite on their authority, possibly pointing to a final reckoning between you and Xardas so epical even gods fear the outcome.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 12, 2019, 11:03:02 pm
I loved how in Gothic II (I know I've already said that but whatever, sue me) most of the NPCs (specially many opposing you both as enemies and simple assholes you have to deal with) are religious fanaticals. And in the end you and
Xardas, your "mentor", prevail agaist all of them despite not giving a fuck about the gods on their or your side. So, as I felt it, it's wasn't about ascending to the level of gods for achieving godhood but to spite on their authority, possibly pointing to a final reckoning between you and Xardas so epical even gods fear the outcome.

Yeah, I just like actually being a god.  Sure, I can thumb my nose at the gods and feel triumphant over my calvaliar "I don't care" attitude, but that won't give me eternal life and the literal power of creation.  lol 
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 13, 2019, 12:19:58 am
Well, their lore is their lore.  Personally, I try not to allow my own real life personal beliefs and agnosticism to affect my rage level directed at fictional fantasy video games.  I am no believer but I love the fictional gods of my favorite fantasy settings, such as TES and Forgotten Realms.  I find them to be much more enjoyable than what we get with Dragon Age.  I'm a big fan of Sheogorath, Azura, Mystra and Elistraee.  So if the Maker turned out to be real and it was DONE well, preferably in a way that rocks the chantry to the core, I would be very pleased.

Oh well anything that makes for a good story is always welcome. The problem with Dragon Age is how often the writers try to force a controversy that just doesn't exist; now normally this wouldn't bother me but it clearly tries to make reference to real events and it often comes off as ignorant and misguided. Say what you will about the Daedra in the Elder Scrolls but they only exist to serve the story and not some inane point about the necessity for religious institutions to regulate society.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 13, 2019, 01:08:50 am
Well, their lore is their lore.  Personally, I try not to allow my own real life personal beliefs and agnosticism to affect my rage level directed at fictional fantasy video games.  I am no believer but I love the fictional gods of my favorite fantasy settings, such as TES and Forgotten Realms.  I find them to be much more enjoyable than what we get with Dragon Age.  I'm a big fan of Sheogorath, Azura, Mystra and Elistraee.  So if the Maker turned out to be real and it was DONE well, preferably in a way that rocks the chantry to the core, I would be very pleased.

Oh well anything that makes for a good story is always welcome. The problem with Dragon Age is how often the writers try to force a controversy that just doesn't exist; now normally this wouldn't bother me but it clearly tries to make reference to real events and it often comes off as ignorant and misguided. Say what you will about the Daedra in the Elder Scrolls but they only exist to serve the story and not some inane point about the necessity for religious institutions to regulate society.

See, I get "The Chantry is delusional and sucks" when I play Dragon Age.  Maybe its just a matter of perspective.  I know that the *Chantry* thinks that they need to be around to regulate the mages (unless Leliana becomes the new Divine, you can help her do that and she will announce many changes, including mages are now completely free to be their own individuals, all over Thedas) but to me that doesn't mean BioWare is trying to SAY this is the ultimate truth.  I love Dragon Age very much but they need to inject some fresh stuff into the franchise. 
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 16, 2019, 04:33:12 pm
See, I get "The Chantry is delusional and sucks" when I play Dragon Age.  Maybe its just a matter of perspective.  I know that the *Chantry* thinks that they need to be around to regulate the mages (unless Leliana becomes the new Divine, you can help her do that and she will announce many changes, including mages are now completely free to be their own individuals, all over Thedas) but to me that doesn't mean BioWare is trying to SAY this is the ultimate truth.  I love Dragon Age very much but they need to inject some fresh stuff into the franchise.

Interesting opinion of yours there. I'll reconsider.

As for what Dragon Age needs, I personally believe it needs to just screw up less.

I mean, the main story missions in Inquisition were outrageously amazing. Time travelling in Redcliffe, The Battle of Haven, the Coup attempt at Orlais, the Siege at the Grey Warden base. I don't think there was a single story mission I honestly didn't like from that game.

The problem to me was the sheer amount of boredom involving the sidequests. It was like playing a whole 'nother game while doing those chores in the Hinterlands alone, to not even mention all the other places where NOTHING was happening.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 17, 2019, 06:17:48 am
See, I get "The Chantry is delusional and sucks" when I play Dragon Age.  Maybe its just a matter of perspective.  I know that the *Chantry* thinks that they need to be around to regulate the mages (unless Leliana becomes the new Divine, you can help her do that and she will announce many changes, including mages are now completely free to be their own individuals, all over Thedas) but to me that doesn't mean BioWare is trying to SAY this is the ultimate truth.  I love Dragon Age very much but they need to inject some fresh stuff into the franchise.

Interesting opinion of yours there. I'll reconsider.

As for what Dragon Age needs, I personally believe it needs to just screw up less.

I mean, the main story missions in Inquisition were outrageously amazing. Time travelling in Redcliffe, The Battle of Haven, the Coup attempt at Orlais, the Siege at the Grey Warden base. I don't think there was a single story mission I honestly didn't like from that game.

The problem to me was the sheer amount of boredom involving the sidequests. It was like playing a whole 'nother game while doing those chores in the Hinterlands alone, to not even mention all the other places where NOTHING was happening.

I agree.  DAI was another triumph, story-wise and character-wise.  But running back and forth across massive terrain got a little tedious.  That's why I like to check out this guy's saves now that I have played it myself a bunch:

https://www.nexusmods.com/dragonageinquisition/users/21471159?tab=user+files

And if you don't like his world state, that can always be fixed by creating your own character, with the world state you want, then exporting that world state into his save with the Save editor.  Only problem is that his saves seem to already have Hawke. I wish he had left the Hawke creation to us. 

Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 18, 2019, 03:50:50 am
I agree.  DAI was another triumph, story-wise and character-wise.  But running back and forth across massive terrain got a little tedious.  That's why I like to check out this guy's saves now that I have played it myself a bunch:

https://www.nexusmods.com/dragonageinquisition/users/21471159?tab=user+files

And if you don't like his world state, that can always be fixed by creating your own character, with the world state you want, then exporting that world state into his save with the Save editor.  Only problem is that his saves seem to already have Hawke. I wish he had left the Hawke creation to us.

That's a rather thorough and interesting interpretation of modding !
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: fylimar on July 01, 2019, 09:14:08 pm
See, I get "The Chantry is delusional and sucks" when I play Dragon Age.  Maybe its just a matter of perspective.  I know that the *Chantry* thinks that they need to be around to regulate the mages (unless Leliana becomes the new Divine, you can help her do that and she will announce many changes, including mages are now completely free to be their own individuals, all over Thedas) but to me that doesn't mean BioWare is trying to SAY this is the ultimate truth.  I love Dragon Age very much but they need to inject some fresh stuff into the franchise.

Interesting opinion of yours there. I'll reconsider.

As for what Dragon Age needs, I personally believe it needs to just screw up less.

I mean, the main story missions in Inquisition were outrageously amazing. Time travelling in Redcliffe, The Battle of Haven, the Coup attempt at Orlais, the Siege at the Grey Warden base. I don't think there was a single story mission I honestly didn't like from that game.

The problem to me was the sheer amount of boredom involving the sidequests. It was like playing a whole 'nother game while doing those chores in the Hinterlands alone, to not even mention all the other places where NOTHING was happening.

I agree, that DAI was too big. I love the game for it's great characters and interesting main quests (and even some side quests - I loved all of Crestwoods quests for example, my favorite map) and I don't have to spill out, how much I love the Redcliffe quest with Dorian for the Doctor Who vibes, but all the fetching quests were just too much imo.

Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on July 02, 2019, 02:57:52 am
See, I get "The Chantry is delusional and sucks" when I play Dragon Age.  Maybe its just a matter of perspective.  I know that the *Chantry* thinks that they need to be around to regulate the mages (unless Leliana becomes the new Divine, you can help her do that and she will announce many changes, including mages are now completely free to be their own individuals, all over Thedas) but to me that doesn't mean BioWare is trying to SAY this is the ultimate truth.  I love Dragon Age very much but they need to inject some fresh stuff into the franchise.

Interesting opinion of yours there. I'll reconsider.

As for what Dragon Age needs, I personally believe it needs to just screw up less.

I mean, the main story missions in Inquisition were outrageously amazing. Time travelling in Redcliffe, The Battle of Haven, the Coup attempt at Orlais, the Siege at the Grey Warden base. I don't think there was a single story mission I honestly didn't like from that game.

The problem to me was the sheer amount of boredom involving the sidequests. It was like playing a whole 'nother game while doing those chores in the Hinterlands alone, to not even mention all the other places where NOTHING was happening.

I agree, that DAI was too big. I love the game for it's great characters and interesting main quests (and even some side quests - I loved all of Crestwoods quests for example, my favorite map) and I don't have to spill out, how much I love the Redcliffe quest with Dorian for the Doctor Who vibes, but all the fetching quests were just too much imo.

Overall, the game is a triumph and certainly a financial and critical success, but I agree.  All the little hither and thither, collect 40 pieces of this and 100 shards of that and 30 of these statuettes and 15 of these coins, etc was massive overkill. 
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on August 04, 2019, 08:07:44 pm
Overall, the game is a triumph and certainly a financial and critical success, but I agree.  All the little hither and thither, collect 40 pieces of this and 100 shards of that and 30 of these statuettes and 15 of these coins, etc was massive overkill.

Hopefully EA has also learned that lesson from Anthem as well, which apparently had a ton of fetching attached to it's gameplay.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on August 04, 2019, 11:12:28 pm
Anthem? That Iron Man-ish game they ended up releasing it only despite being 100% crap because for all the hype behind was the perfect field test for new adwares?
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on August 04, 2019, 11:30:42 pm
Anthem? That Iron Man-ish game they ended up releasing it only despite being 100% crap because for all the hype behind was the perfect field test for new adwares?

The same one. Hopefully Casey Hudson will make sure everyone learns from the experience and move on forward with much better games from now on.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on August 06, 2019, 09:36:29 am
Overall, the game is a triumph and certainly a financial and critical success, but I agree.  All the little hither and thither, collect 40 pieces of this and 100 shards of that and 30 of these statuettes and 15 of these coins, etc was massive overkill.

Hopefully EA has also learned that lesson from Anthem as well, which apparently had a ton of fetching attached to it's gameplay.

I'm still excited for Dragon Age 4 though.  :D
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on August 06, 2019, 12:31:48 pm
I'm still excited for Dragon Age 4 though.  :D

Same here. I'm pretty confident it can be the best Dragon Age game if they correct the DAI issues.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on August 09, 2019, 08:16:19 am
I'm still excited for Dragon Age 4 though.  :D

Same here. I'm pretty confident it can be the best Dragon Age game if they correct the DAI issues.

Agreed.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on August 09, 2019, 08:19:39 pm
Solas as the villain though... not very exciting to me xD
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on August 10, 2019, 05:11:53 am
Solas as the villain though... not very exciting to me xD

Well, he is one of them, but that doesn't mean there won't be another.  If you recall, the previous game really had two antagonists as well.  Solas may not even be the primary antagonist this time 'round. 
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on August 10, 2019, 06:19:48 am
Anyone heard of the tv series remake of the lord of the rings films?
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Ghanima_Atreides on August 10, 2019, 08:42:46 am
Yes, but it's not a remake. It's set in the 2nd era and will center around Sauron's rise to power.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on August 10, 2019, 08:47:38 am
Oh thank god. I heard it was a remake
Now I hope it won't portray Sauron as a human cliché tragical ex good hero turned evil
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Ghanima_Atreides on August 10, 2019, 09:21:01 am
Well I assume it will follow the lore, which establishes pretty clearly who Sauron was (not human for once) and how he turned to evil. And the Tolkien Estate are pretty particular about adaptations taking into account the Professor's lore.

That being said, his fall as written by Tolkien IS pretty stereotypical...
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Barabbah on August 10, 2019, 10:24:38 am
I've never imagined him outside his movie appearance. To me it was only an eerie and constant precence of an ancient evil.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: Highwayman667 on August 19, 2019, 02:52:27 am
Well, he is one of them, but that doesn't mean there won't be another.  If you recall, the previous game really had two antagonists as well.  Solas may not even be the primary antagonist this time 'round.

Maybe it'll be someone new. I really can't imagine anyone outside of... Flemeth ? Not even.
Title: Re: Fantasy Lore
Post by: DarkZephyr on August 20, 2019, 06:30:10 am
Well, he is one of them, but that doesn't mean there won't be another.  If you recall, the previous game really had two antagonists as well.  Solas may not even be the primary antagonist this time 'round.

Maybe it'll be someone new. I really can't imagine anyone outside of... Flemeth ? Not even.

I imagine it will be someone new. 

When you think about it, every other entry into the series had at least two antagonists, sometimes more, as one may pop up as a surprise Antagonist when you least expect it, so even if Solas is some kind of antagonist, its quite highly unlikely that he will be the only one.  And Flemeth becoming an antagonist would be like Elminster or Gandalf becoming antagonists, so I truly doubt it.  I think it will be someone totally new or someone only lightly touched on in previous entries, or like a legend or other background character. 

But yeah, there is always more than one Antagonist.

Dragon Age Origins: 1. Arl Howe 2. Teyrn Loghain 3. Urthemiel, the Archdemon

Dragon Age 2: 1. The Arishok  2. (Sadly as a Surprise Antagonist) First Enchanter Orsino  3. Knight-Commander Meredith Stannard

Dragon Age Inquisition: 1. Corypheus 2. (Surprise Antagonist) Solas/Dread Wolf
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