Potence

[Radical21]

I'm just wondering about it because P.202 says that in addition to automatic success , Potence adds to the Str-based dicepool when lifting/breaking stuff so while I don't see why it would give automatic success on an attack roll(a to-hit check) wont it increase the Strength dicepool for it in much the same manner? .

Then again if a Character has 3 Strength , 3 Potence and 3 Brawl his Attack Dicepool would be 9 which is really high and he get 3 automatic success for damage with it.

What do you think?
(So far Iv been following option 1 of the poll and ignoring potence on Attack rolls and applying them only to Damage)

[Rick Gentle]

As far as I'm concerned - and I know I'm not part of this chronicle, but no-one else has responded yet - Potence and Fortitude need to balance one another. If Potence gives automatic successes to damage, Fortitude needs to give automatic successes to soak. It seems foolish that Potence wouldn't give automatic successes all the time, since it's not like you can simply "turn it off". Superhuman strength isn't exactly a risky characteristic, so you shouldn't need a dice roll for it. When calculating lifting power, I simply add together (Strength + Potence) and consult the table on page 202.
So, if someone has Strength 4 and Potence 4, their effective Strength is 8, which means they can break a 3" lead pipe and anything below. No roll necessary unless it's in an act of contention, like one person trying to break down a door while another is holding it. Only in those cases, where there's a competition going on, or there's a real risk, should Potence need to be rolled as part of a dice pool.

So to answer the question: Automatic successes to damage, but not to attack. If someone completely misses the attack roll, they're not going to be doing any damage at all, so it doesn't matter how Potent they are.

[Radical21]

As far as I'm concerned - and I know I'm not part of this chronicle, but no-one else has responded yet - Potence and Fortitude need to balance one another. If Potence gives automatic successes to damage, Fortitude needs to give automatic successes to soak.

Rick I am talking about Attack Rolls only, NOT damage rolls.

I only mentioned an example to show how potentially deadly Potence would be on an Elder if option 2 is taken..

Please try to stay on topic

[Rick Gentle]

"Should Potence be used for attack rolls?
No, Only Damage Rolls 2 (100%)"

??

[Radical21]

"Should Potence be used for attack rolls?
No, Only Damage Rolls 2 (100%)"

??

Yeah thats what I asked... I already know its being used for Damage rolls and thats not a problem.

[Friktion]

What attack roll is strength + brawl?

[Aydoo]

Grabs are STR + Brawl. So is Tackle, Clinch, and quite a few other close combat attacks that require grabbing someone or something similar.

[Friktion]

Alright so here's what I gather:

"The player rolls all strength-related tests normally, but then adds an automatic success for each point he has in Potence."
"In melee and brawling combat, the automatic successes are applied to the damage roll results."  (page 170)

Clinch : "On a successful attack roll, the attacker goes into a clinch with the target.  In the first turn the attacker may roll strength damage." (page 211)
--So your Potence will NOT give you automatic success to clinch the target, but will give you automatic success for strength damage.

Hold : "This attack inflicts no damage. ... At that time, both combatants roll resisted Strength + Brawl actions; the subject remains immobilized until she rolls more successes than the attacker does." (page 211)
--So your Potence will give you an automatic success to hold the target even though it's not a damage roll because it is a strength-related test.  Each subject's turn, both combatants roll Strength + Brawl.  The subject is held until she outrolls the attacker (resisted, not extended.)

Tackle : "The attack roll is made at +1 difficulty and the maneuver inflicts Strength + 1 damage." (page 212)
--Potence will NOT give you automatic success to tackle the target, but will give you automatic success for strength damage if successful.

Now in terms of lifting/breaking/dragging/opening/closing:
"The chart (page 202) below provides the minimum strength needed to deadlift or break various weights without a die roll.  Characters of lower strength may roll to affect heavier weights than their Strength scores allow for.  The rolls is made not with Strength, but with Willpoewr, and difficulty 9.  Each success advances the character by one level on the chart.  The Potence discipline also adds its dots to the character's effective Strength."

So if a character has strength 3 and Potence 2 - they can lift/break up to 650 pounds without needing to roll.  If they want to go higher than that, they roll their Willpower.  This isn't a strength-related test, so Potence does not give any automatic successes on this roll.