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Offline Acleacius

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Open End Game, progress?
« on: June 12, 2016, 05:14:35 pm »
Thanks for all the excellent modding for Bloodlines.   :vampsmile:

Has there been any progress on, returning the player onto the streets in normal mode, after end game (Well if your player is still alive anyway.  :vampwink: ) ?  I was hoping for something, compatible with Bloodlines Unofficial Patch, if something does exist currently.

Thanks
Trust me, most of the names I have been called you can't translate in any language...they're not even real words as much as a succession of violent images.

Offline The Shadow Man

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2016, 06:50:20 pm »
Well I don't know what progress people have made (if any) there and it might be good if you wanna do quests after the main ending but for it to make sense there would have to be certain changes. There properly should be more quests only available after the ending as well. Without a Prince or with a Sabbat hold over the city (if your using UP+ and sided with the Sabbat) things would properly change drastically.

Offline Acleacius

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2016, 01:31:50 pm »
That's a really good idea, but yeah I can see the different faction issues could make that extremely tough. I bet having the Open World functionality as a stand alone (if possible) would make it much easier for a big project like Post Game quest story-line. It could even be divided up into different faction quests. I really can't think of any quest goal that would unify them all, atm.
Trust me, most of the names I have been called you can't translate in any language...they're not even real words as much as a succession of violent images.

Offline The Shadow Man

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2016, 02:28:53 pm »
Well the endings that you survive there's only like four (including the Sabbat ending added with UP+). If you side with the Sabbat don't see the Sabbat been terribly peaceful with the remaining Camarilla and Anarchs properly turn, leave or die approach maybe ending in a all out battle. If you side with Camarilla (via Strauss), I don't think Strauss would becoming Prince unless there was no one else to take the job, maybe Tearese but of course that would depend on earlier game choices. If you side with the Anarchs well according to what I've read which admittedly properly not as much as a lot of people, the Anarch Free State for a while had broken up into rival street gangs, maybe this would happen again in LA while it dosen't seem likely that would happen based on Anarchs we have met, how many Anarchs do we actually meet like seven? (including Ash, V.V. and Jack). Finally the Independent ending suggests you leave LA.   

While I'm sure its possible to open up back up the LA street after any ending (even ones you die) it wouldn't make much sense without any repercussions. Like how you could most likely swap around the models of NPCs, while it wouldn't make sense to say switch Andrei and Lacroix around I'm sure its possible.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2016, 02:30:42 pm by The Shadow Man »

Offline Acleacius

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2016, 08:45:25 am »
Yeah, there's a lot of great possibilities. I've mostly stuck to the Lone Wolf ending, and I'm not sure it necessarily means you leave L.A. but you defiantly choose not to join a side. I've only sided with the Camarilla and Anarchs a few times, long ago. Heard about the new Sabot ending, which sounds great for those who don't mind working with them. I've never really played villainous toons, so probably not my style.

I mostly would like the functionality and when you try to warp down to the streets you lose all your gear (maybe stats), can't recall atm. I guess the major issues will be, returning the maps and vendors to their normal state. Also unlocking all the doors, zones and maps. I think just being able to go back into the game would inspire new ideas, just by being there and getting a feel for it with a more tactile approach.
Trust me, most of the names I have been called you can't translate in any language...they're not even real words as much as a succession of violent images.

Offline The Shadow Man

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #5 on: June 15, 2016, 10:36:07 am »
Well frankly it wouldn't be fair or realistic to do it for just one ending. Well I was basing the idea that you leave L.A. in the Independent / Lone Wolf Ending from the dialogue from the Taxi Driver or "Caine" he makes it sound like you will or should leave the city after defeating the Keui-Jin and the Camarilla, something along the lines of "Out of this city and into a legend", of course you could choose not or change your mind. Things would change quiet a bit after each ending you survive as I have stated previously, It would also make sense if you were given quests to bring these changes along. Prisha the flesh eating Vampire says she is going to leave L.A. soon so it would make sense if she disappears much like the Thin Bloods except the one that doesn't. Sure all side quests from Humans could still be available except those that require Keui-Jin or certain Kindred to complete.

Offline Acleacius

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2016, 12:21:04 am »
I was just going from the cutscene which is the last thing we see. Basically we are walking the streets of L.A. after the ending. Personally I just want it open to explore possibilities of all the things you've mentioned plus things I'm sure others are interested in.

So it's the Caine figure with Jack causing all the unease NPCs like Becket and Pisha are feeling, since we know it's not the sarcophagus. And he would be staying, which would continue the unease. Guess that makes sense, though I'm guessing he was intentionally NOT shielding himself to create the feeling of unease. I'm betting he could shield himself if he wished to.

Anyway, like I said to me, it's more important to open the door first to let everyone inside, then get the ideas flowing. I think it would cause a huge problem to try to force the quests first. Since it would just create too many questions, which need time and community interaction to resolve.
Trust me, most of the names I have been called you can't translate in any language...they're not even real words as much as a succession of violent images.

Offline The Shadow Man

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2016, 01:22:00 am »
Sure, sure, I understand what your saying, thats a far point. I'm not really much of a modder. I mean I've changed the HUD a bit, edited one discipline image and recoloured Max's outfit but thats about it. I'm still trying to change the colour of the "health" in the health bar. I have no understanding of Bloodlines coding, I'm sure its possible but I don't know how to do, Wesp might be a good person to talk to.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2016, 01:29:01 am by The Shadow Man »

Offline Wesp5

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2016, 10:02:35 am »
I was just going from the cutscene which is the last thing we see. Basically we are walking the streets of L.A. after the ending. Personally I just want it open to explore possibilities of all the things you've mentioned plus things I'm sure others are interested in.

The problem that I see with this, besides changing maps and scripts to actually do it which should be possible, is that there is little in the way of voice-overs left to make it work. Like all the main NPC still alive won't be able to talk with you anymore or will just repeat old things...

Offline Acleacius

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #9 on: June 16, 2016, 06:26:39 pm »
True, but I had sort of hoped we were past the point of worrying about the voice issues. Sadly I haven't played all the mods, but I know many of them are adding and doing voice work.

I can see how this would need to be an 'Optional' part of the UBP or at least it's my hope, it would become part. Since, if the foundation of the unlocking is done in the UBP then it would make modding new areas and quests more universal and compatible in the long run. Really wish I was skilled enough to do it, but I'm just thinking about the long term game for the community.
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Offline FleshArtist

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #10 on: June 17, 2016, 07:12:28 pm »
While it would be interesting to do this, there really isn't much at all to do, the way the Bloodlines ending sequences and quests were engineered to make it seem like everything fell apart after LaCroix died in L.A, and we can assume that in the Lone Wolf ending, the neonate PC leaves the city. I guess only the Camarilla ending would leave space for an open world play, but for that to work, there would have to be LOTS more to do, more quests, more people, and more locations/hubs. I was considering doing something of this sort for Antitribu. But on a technical viewpoint, how would it work? Would you just teleport to the streets of Downtown after the credits ended, also, as WesP brought up, what are the main characters going to say?

Offline The Shadow Man

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #11 on: June 17, 2016, 10:45:47 pm »
While it would be interesting to do this, there really isn't much at all to do, the way the Bloodlines ending sequences and quests were engineered to make it seem like everything fell apart after LaCroix died in L.A, and we can assume that in the Lone Wolf ending, the neonate PC leaves the city. I guess only the Camarilla ending would leave space for an open world play, but for that to work, there would have to be LOTS more to do, more quests, more people, and more locations/hubs. I was considering doing something of this sort for Antitribu. But on a technical viewpoint, how would it work? Would you just teleport to the streets of Downtown after the credits ended, also, as WesP brought up, what are the main characters going to say?

Maybe the Anarch Ending too? Part of the Anarch "course" could be helping to keep stability in the now Camerilla-less L.A. which would be defiantly something to do. Part of the Camerilla "course" could be dealing with what happens next after Lacroix is got rid of, maybe he is executed, maybe you could even become Prince (Hey you may be a Neonate but you brought down the Kuei-Jinn in L.A., Sabbat in L.A., at least some of the Camarilla Ventrue in L.A. and the Sheriff along with everything else you did). One thing you could do of course is move the credits to later on maybe create whole new endings later on.

Offline Acleacius

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #12 on: June 18, 2016, 12:59:57 am »
To me, the Cam has always just represented government. So L.A. would just be back to the way it was an Anarch Free State, no matter who was left, in Vanilla game anyway. Think the point is Lone Wolf, Cam or Anarch wouldn't require the Player to leave, the Blood Hunt would be over, no matter which ending. So to me getting the game, map and NPCs just talking saying their standard line would be a great starting point.

Guess it would have to be a separate mod until it was normalized. Obviously porting to the Downtown cab location, completely unlocking the map, normal Santa Monica map, all NPC vendors would have normal dialog. Probably getting Venus's dialog to continue giving us money!  :vampwink:
Trust me, most of the names I have been called you can't translate in any language...they're not even real words as much as a succession of violent images.

Offline Wesp5

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2016, 10:06:18 pm »
Guess it would have to be a separate mod until it was normalized.

Exactly. As I don't think Paradox or Obsidion will do something like this, the mod would be a true and immediate sequel to Bloodlines! So anybody interested go ahead and make it...

Offline FleshArtist

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Re: Open End Game, progress?
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2016, 12:21:17 am »
I guess we also have a problem with how the lore is structured as a whole, based off of the ToJ series (which we can all come to a general agreement that it was horrible I'm sure), Gehenna occurs in 2005, which would just give the neonate in Bloodlines about 6-12 more months before it's all over. I guess you could get some good story play in during that time, but it just really bugs me about how cWoD gets cut a little short due to ToJ's added "canon".

 

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