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Author Topic: Bloodlines maps in Hammer  (Read 2528 times)

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Offline [archive] DaedalusRaistlin

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Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
« on: February 11, 2007, 03:50:00 AM »
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  •                 Not sure if anyone has tried this before, but I ran a decompiler on the sp_tutorial1 map.
     
     The level itself decompiles well, and I don't see any problems in that.
     However, the entities do not contain any outputs.
     Also, since the textures are in an unkown format, I had to settle to giving you guys a screenshot containing mostly white, and ERROR models.
     
     The shot I took is in the tutorial level, near the computer and safe.
     
     I'm wondering, what would the legality be of porting the game to the current Source engine?
     
     It would require some work, of course. I might ask the author of the map decompile tool if he could try to get entity outputs decompiled.
     
     What about the textures and sounds? We'd need to get the author of the bloodlines tool to make some sort of batch converter so we could have .vtf format images.
     
     Also, a lot of coding would be needed to implement all the different entities that were written specifically for Bloodlines.
     
     I think though, everyone would benefit from a port (if you'd call it that) to the latest source engine, and breathe new life into the game (in a manner of speaking...)
     
     If anyone wants some more information, post here or PM me.
     
     View the image                        

     

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    Offline [archive] Gardeb6103737

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    Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #1 on: February 11, 2007, 01:11:00 PM »
                    In Reply To #1
     Actually yes, you are not the only one who has decompiled Bloodlines maps. And I did progress a bit further. I converted all needed Textures and fixed the errors that occured due to erroneous vmt-files. The whole thing took me a night due to the lack of a batch converter.
     - Are there any descriptions of the tth/ttz fileformat around? Or maybe turfster could create a release of his great bloodlines tools without any gui.
     After that I created and compiled a Halflife 2 mod, ripped all models that weren't de- and recompiled for the purpose of demonstration, compiled the map. And voilà I created a running, but due to the lack of certain entities and solid tools, a bit buggy but stable map.
     Here are some Screenshots:
     Bloodlines:
     <img>http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/2079/smpawnshop10001a z2.th.jpg</img>
     <img>http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/7586/smpawnshop10000m z8.th.jpg</img>
     HL2 Mod:
     <img>http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/8163/smps0002dd7.th.jpg</ img>
     <img>http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/6029/smps0000lr0.th.jpg</ img>
     Like you I'm not certain about the legal issues in this case. But this point may be crucial:
     "- New Game Materials may be created only if such New Game Materials can be used exclusively in combination with the retail version of the Program. New Game Materials may not be designed to be used as a stand-alone product."
     Technically I wouldn't call a mod a "stand-alone product", but it's level of independence nearly makes it one. I believe that we can't be sure till we have checked with Activision if it's alright.
     Back to the technical parts...
     The sonds are no major problem, Bloodlines "sound-schemes" aren't implemented in HL2 but this shouldn't be a lot of work to implement.
     What may be crucial are the models, sure cannonfodder has provided a mdl-decompiler that may decompile VTMB moldel reference files, but that's it. There is no decompiler for the animations, and the problem is that cannonfodder hasn't continued his projects for quite a while... This may result in the fact that we'll have to write our own mdl-decompiler.
     Has anyone knowledge of a description of the Bloodlines specific mdl format?
     I believe that the specific entities will result in some work, but they aren't endless, but creating a good AI may be challenging.
     The last point is, that people are required to own both games VTMB and HL2. Maybe we should ask the question if there is actually a "market" for this mod or will the five guys who own both games stick to their original versions?
                           

     

                                                      

    Offline [archive] DaedalusRaistlin

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    Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #2 on: February 11, 2007, 02:17:00 PM »
                    In Reply To #2
     
     Awesome! I'm so glad to see I'm not the only one interested in this!
     
     I'm impressed with what you managed to get running too! Was that a lot of opening up texture X, click Convert to VTF, etc?
     
     I've had a bit of a breakthrough with entity outputs. I looked at the VMF and saw that they werent put into the "connections" segment of the entity info, so I wrote a quick tool to do so.
     
     It looks for any line that has "On in it, and conciders that an output.
     
     So far that seems to work fine, and as you can see, it is working!
     
     As to the audience...I'm sure there are a significant number of people who have HL2 as well as Bloodlines...
     And if they don't, perhaps the promise of a new engine and sdk tools would entice them to buy it grin
     
     I'll upload the tool I used to fix the maps in a moment, it's written in C++ and I'm distributing the source only.
     
     It will be availible at my website shortly!
     
     [added Feb 12 2007  7:17AM]
     
     I managed to convert all the textures, except the stuff in the models directory (since we have no converter :\)
     
     Took me nearly 12 hours, lol.
     
     All this, and I see that a LOT of textures are missing.
     
     I have no idea why so many are missing :\
     
     Does anyone have a converter for the vampire models so we can place them into the latest source engine?                        

     

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    Offline [archive] Gardeb6103737

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    Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #3 on: February 12, 2007, 05:56:00 PM »
                    In Reply To #3
     It's nice to see you getting further.
     I downloaded your fix and compiled it, works fine...
     12 hours is a lot time, but having all textures converted is good, very good.
     I can't believe that it's so hard to convert tth/ttz to vtf or tga. Maybe we'll have to write a convenient ourself. 12h with a macro is definitively too much.
     Did you copy all vmt-files, maybe you've missed a few.
     As far as I know there is only cannonfodders mdl-decompiler. The problem is that it is only able to decompile the reference files.
     I haven't got a lot of time in the next days, but I'll have a look at the vampire mdl and smd-files and maybe I'm able to write a small decompiler. At least for the reference files.                        

     

                                                      

    Offline [archive] PhoenixParsley

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    Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #4 on: February 12, 2007, 09:11:00 PM »
                    hi there
     
     i bought the vtmb two days ago and it rocks, but the bugs hit me too. bad fps rate and control bugs are very annoying.
     
     and i thought, omg this game on the up to date source engine would kick ass.
     
     i was searching for bug solutions and read this. and hey, you have all my blessings with the vtmb-to-source-project.
     
     i decompiled the sp_tutorial_1.bsp too and loaded it with hammer. it works. it would be maybe months and years of work, but its possible.
     
     i have a slow pc and mapping costs lots of time, but maybe i´ll experiment a little bit with the vampire *.bsps
     
     greets                        

     

                                                      

    Offline [archive] DaedalusRaistlin

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    Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #5 on: February 13, 2007, 09:33:00 AM »
                    Well I managed to get the extra textures, I must've missed a vpk file.
     
     I'm going to ask around and see if anyone can come up with some sort of .mdl recompiler (recompile it to be compatible with the latest source engine.)
     
     I can't seem to open sm_apartment_1 though :\ I had wanted to use this map as a test, but alas it crashes hammer every time I try to open it :\                        

     

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    Offline [archive] Gardeb6103737

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    Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #6 on: February 13, 2007, 02:37:00 PM »
                    In Reply To #6
     Some bsp-files may also contain game content, but I haven't checked, if this was also used in VTMB, yet.
     About the mdl-files, I searched the modding forum archives and couldn't find an alternative to cannonfodders mdldecompiler.
     But I had a look at the mdl and smt files and I have figured out where and how the reference triangles are stored. Now I intend to write a decompiler for VTMB myself in Java that is at least as capable as the known one.
     As long as there's no solution to de- and recompile I would propose to use "dummy models".
     sm_apartment_1.bsp decompiles and works fine with my hammer. The original and the fixed (btw good job) work.
     Maybe it has something to do with a corrupt material definition check all used vtm files.
     Another problem might be the decompiler, what program do you use? I used vmex 0.95 to decompile my maps.
     If this won't work out for you I would suggest to use sm_pawnshop_1 since I've already created a somehow running version of this map and we could compare results.
     On the other hand working with maps that haven't got a lot of materials will make it easier for people to join until we've found/buit a tth/ttz to vtf batchconverter.
                           

     

                                                      

    Offline [archive] *sam*43077890

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    Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #7 on: February 13, 2007, 09:52:00 PM »
                    In Reply To #7
     
     i may be abit dunce here but i dont get the benefits of this.
     
     what tangible benefits would this bring? i dont want to sound insulting, i just would like to here the purpose of this from people who know what they're are doing. (i.e. you guys)                        

     

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    Offline [archive] DaedalusRaistlin

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    Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #8 on: February 14, 2007, 12:28:00 AM »
                    In Reply To #7
     Awesome! I was thinking of, and still might, building some of my own crude props to replace the current ones, so that we may have at least examples of what it all will look like.
     
     I'm using Vmex 0.98, so I'll try the earlier version and see if it works.
     
     EDIT: Nope, doesn't matter what options I change, nor what mod I run Hammer under, Hammer crashes when trying to open sm_apartment_1 :\
     
     I guess that's one map I'll leave to you wink
     
     In Reply To #8
     
     When you play Bloodlines, do you ever get low FPS rates? Long load times? Graphical glitches?
     
     Do you yearn for the ability to add more content to one of the  most atmospheric and downright awesome games ever made?
     
     For me, the above is all true. I found some areas of Bloodlines downright unplayable, even on a decent video card (G6600 GT).
     
     Modern day Source engine runs like a dream on my system.
     
     So the solution? Convert Bloodlines to run on modern day Source.
     
     You'd get all of the benefits of having a modern day engine (fixing all those slowdowns and glitches), as well as the ability to mod the game to your dark heart's desire.                        

     

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    Offline [archive] DaedalusRaistlin

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    Re: Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #9 on: February 15, 2007, 09:56:00 PM »
                    In Reply To #10
     
     Sure thing, I just setup another forum area on my website, http://www.thedaedalus.net/phpBB2/
     
     I'll post there from now on wink
     
     I couldn't link directly to it since the damn boards converted my url to lowercase...                        

     

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    Offline [archive] Gardeb6103737

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    Bloodlines maps in Hammer
    « Reply #10 on: February 15, 2007, 01:04:00 PM »
                    In Reply To #8
     Except those points Daedalus has already mentioned, there are al lot of other benefits that can be accomplished by a full port of the game.
     Tools that are developed for this project may also be used by the community to mod the original VTMB. For example a batch-converter for textures may be of great use for those who intend to retexture whole maps. Or maybe a new mdl-decompiler will inspire someone to write a mdl-compiler. etc.
     Other arguments are the more sophisticated engine and the approved SDK and as a plus the then available "hard-code" that will allow a fully mod- , debug- and maintainable game that can be customized by everyone in every manner.
     
     In Reply To #9
     Ok I'll check what's it all about with am_apartment_1.
     I would guess that it has something to do with a corrupt material file or something like that.
     Daedalus, can you provide some space on your homepage, where we can exchange and discuss our current progress?
     Or would this result in a lot of work for you? If yes, - never mind, we'll find a different solution.