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Author Topic: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?  (Read 3604 times)

Offline MasterVampire

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Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« on: July 19, 2018, 12:41:53 AM »
So VTMB came out in 2004.
Back then there were no smartphones.

But today everyone has a phone with a camera.
There’s also the rise of social media, the internet, and lots more surveillance with cctv cameras everywhere.

So would it be only a matter of time before vampires are exposed and hunted down ?

Offline DiamondBorne

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2018, 12:53:37 AM »
Nah. The human were too busy killing each other. The real question is, were Illuminati real and is entirely human faction, what will be their stance towards kindred organizations? kowtow to us? try to expose us? working with us as an equal?

Offline IanW

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2018, 05:17:32 AM »
Vampire 5th Edition comes out next month. A new concern for vampires is the "Second Inquisition": although society at large is still mostly ignorant, governments and some other institutions are aware of the existence of vampires, and use technology like IR cameras and "metal detectors" at airports and such in order to find them.
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Offline Raving_Neonate

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2018, 04:57:35 PM »
The real question is how long the masquerade will last, since the kindred is bound to be discovered by the majority sooner rather than later.
In my humble opinion, since I lack the statistical information on the current numbers of sect devotees, I think that the kindred is getting too reckless. Camarilla is to my knowledge crumbling at a considerable pace, anarchs are a loose bunch and the Sabat, is well, Sabat. Maybe I will be harshly judged for this, but I would like WoD to have a definite end, since no masquerade can go on forever - if we apply the whole system of degradation to kindred as a whole, there must come a point of "global withering" when the blood becomes to weak to survive. Adding artificial length to the universe would be counter-productive in my opinion.
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Offline Aurelian

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2018, 11:42:41 PM »
The real question is how long the masquerade will last, since the kindred is bound to be discovered by the majority sooner rather than later.
In my humble opinion, since I lack the statistical information on the current numbers of sect devotees, I think that the kindred is getting too reckless. Camarilla is to my knowledge crumbling at a considerable pace, anarchs are a loose bunch and the Sabat, is well, Sabat. Maybe I will be harshly judged for this, but I would like WoD to have a definite end, since no masquerade can go on forever - if we apply the whole system of degradation to kindred as a whole, there must come a point of "global withering" when the blood becomes to weak to survive. Adding artificial length to the universe would be counter-productive in my opinion.

The Masquerade will fail, it is inevitable due to progress of technology and media of the humanity. The real question is how the Kindred across the planet will respond to this. I am sure many can actually make lucrative deals with governments across the world. For example, the Camarilla could help strengthen the NATO, the EU as a bulwark against the other political entities of the world.

Offline deicide

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2018, 07:21:09 AM »
Cellphone cameras and internet pix were around since late 90's. Social media and smartphones are clearly overestimated. The former and public opinion could be easily manipulated or controlled. Nothing essential was changed since Modern Nights.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2018, 07:53:23 AM by deicide »
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Offline Wesp5

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2018, 08:56:58 AM »
Cellphone cameras and internet pix were around since late 90's. Social media and smartphones are clearly overestimated. The former and public opinion could be easily manipulated or controlled. Nothing essential was changed since Modern Nights.

Exactly. Just look at all the fake news problems, especially in the US. People have better technology but a lot have not been getting more intelligent, rather the other way around with all these oligarchs being elected...

Offline Aurelian

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2018, 10:32:13 AM »
Exactly. Just look at all the fake news problems, especially in the US. People have better technology but a lot have not been getting more intelligent, rather the other way around with all these oligarchs being elected...

There is no reason why technology should improve the intelligence of people in the first place. But I also doubt that people are getting dumber, perhaps more easily manipulated by propaganda would be more accurate. Then again, American society is very individualistic. A lone individual is the most easy target to manipulate, as the Greek philosophers noted long ago.


Offline deicide

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2018, 01:09:58 PM »
Exactly. Just look at all the fake news problems, especially in the US. People have better technology but a lot have not been getting more intelligent, rather the other way around with all these oligarchs being elected...

There is another phenomenon, so-called informational overload. I have doubts that bloodsucker videos would surprise anyone these days or even attract any attention. They will drown in that moosh like everything else.

As for the individualism, I would not blame it, modern society is rather selfish or wannabe than individualistic in the original meaning. People care only about themselves, but still doesn't want to think by themselves, which makes them easy targets.
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Offline Wesp5

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2018, 01:16:09 PM »
There is another phenomenon, so-called informational overload. I have doubts that bloodsucker videos would surprise anyone these days or even attract any attention. They will drown in that moosh like everything else.

Yeah, I can see it now "Photoshopped!" :)

Offline deicide

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2018, 03:32:36 PM »
Or, rather, "I admire your skills, dude".
Regarding videos, some mean shorts from 90's could be easily mistaken for snuff films, and even were, by the police and FBI no less. So, I doubt such a fvckups could be considered a masquerade violation any more.
Another point, this modern BS tech is nothing new, wouldn't name a cross between a cellphone, a cheap digital camera and a pad on castrated Ubuntu with wifi exactly an invention. It's buggy, broken by design, has abominable talk/standby time, and potentially vulnerable, which will attract an attention of tech-savvy cainites for sure. Not to say it equally sucks both as a phone and portable PC.
Social networks would be used for tracking down mortals, why bother with police databases if they're filling dossiers on themselves and posting that in public?
« Last Edit: July 20, 2018, 04:32:11 PM by deicide »
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Offline Raving_Neonate

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2018, 04:47:14 PM »
Or, rather, "I admire your skills, dude".
Regarding videos, some mean shorts from 90's could be easily mistaken for snuff films, and even were, by the police and FBI no less. So, I doubt such a fvckups could be considered a masquerade violation any more.
Another point, this modern BS tech is nothing new, wouldn't name a cross between a cellphone, a cheap digital camera and a pad on castrated Ubuntu with wifi exactly an invention. It's buggy, broken by design, has abominable talk/standby time, and potentially vulnerable, which will attract an attention of tech-savvy cainites for sure. Not to say it equally sucks both as a phone and portable PC.
Social networks would be used for tracking down mortals, why bother with police databases if they're filling dossiers on themselves and posting that in public?

But that would go only so far.
Individualism can be a serious threat and single right man in the right place would be enough to throw a wrench into the entire operation and bring it down. Not all people live in the US or in the same manner as the mentioned, so accepting one human mentality as the dominant example would be wrong and would not be applicable in every scenario and on every scale. Some societies are more religious and conservative so there is a lower chance of such manipulation... for example, in my country social networks are not so common or dominant as they are in the US and the most of the Western world so tracking people would be more difficult, plus the harsh times that the people in the Balkans have been exposed to have birthed a more callous and suspicious bunch... two wars and one bombing in the past twenty-five years have created a closed society that would easily shrug off any kindred influence and burn the mentioned far more easily. In my environment, out of 10 people for example, it is completely normal for at least three not to have facebook and every other social network. In my country many things are still being done in an "analog" fashion rather than digital so data exploitation would be tedious.
Me: "I love lollipops!"
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Offline Aurelian

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2018, 05:22:42 PM »
As for the individualism, I would not blame it, modern society is rather selfish or wannabe than individualistic in the original meaning. People care only about themselves, but still doesn't want to think by themselves, which makes them easy targets.

Rampant consumerism and hedonism that plagues the West serves only to isolate the individual and break his/her social bonds. Such a person is highly vulnerable to manipulation. But this is a inevitable logical conclusion to any society that puts the freedom of the individual as its highest moral virtue.

But, considering the topic is about something else, I will no longer comment on this issue.

Offline Aurelian

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2018, 05:26:39 PM »
Some societies are more religious and conservative so there is a lower chance of such manipulation... for example, in my country social networks are not so common or dominant as they are in the US and the most of the Western world so tracking people would be more difficult, plus the harsh times that the people in the Balkans have been exposed to have birthed a more callous and suspicious bunch... two wars and one bombing in the past twenty-five years have created a closed society that would easily shrug off any kindred influence and burn the mentioned far more easily.

Serbia?

Offline Raving_Neonate

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Re: Is the masquerade doomed in the future?
« Reply #14 on: July 20, 2018, 05:32:13 PM »
Some societies are more religious and conservative so there is a lower chance of such manipulation... for example, in my country social networks are not so common or dominant as they are in the US and the most of the Western world so tracking people would be more difficult, plus the harsh times that the people in the Balkans have been exposed to have birthed a more callous and suspicious bunch... two wars and one bombing in the past twenty-five years have created a closed society that would easily shrug off any kindred influence and burn the mentioned far more easily.

Serbia?

Right on.
Me: "I love lollipops!"
WoD ST: "We don't allow lollipops, because we are too dark!"