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Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines 2 => Bloodlines 2 General discussion => Topic started by: Wilhelm Streicher 19 on June 04, 2019, 06:07:03 pm

Title: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm Streicher 19 on June 04, 2019, 06:07:03 pm
Surprise surprise a third Vampire game. This game isn´t the one from Publisher BigBen and Developer Big Bad Wolf (The Council)
This new one from Paradox itself and the Developer is Draw Distance but like the second one is a narrative experience.



The official Steam description.

"Vampire: The Masquerade - Coteries of New York presents the conflict between two vampiric factions: the traditionalist Camarilla and the fiercely independent Anarchs among the iconic landmarks and night lights of The Big Apple. It's a unique, atmospheric, single-player narrative experience, set in a rich, fully licensed, globally recognized universe of Vampire: The Masquerade 5th Edition.

    Choose your character from one of several distinct Clans
    Every playable character offers unique powers (Disciplines), different ethical approaches to certain issues, and dialogue lines
    Character-oriented quests allow you to create your own coterie and shape your relations by reinforcing NPC loyalties
    Highly replayable - choices made in the game are reflected by the game's changing fiction
    Various endings depending on your actions - which conclusion will you reach?
    Suitable for both Vampire: The Masquerade veterans, and fans of mature narrative-driven games who are newcomers to the setting


The game does justice to the mature themes of the World of Darkness, and takes advantage of the excellent atmosphere of the source material. It also creates new stories, which, thanks to the full creative license, will be incorporated as official lore of Vampire: The Masquerade 5th Edition.

What is Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York?
Vampire: The Masquerade - Coteries of New York aims to translate the complex and fascinating world of vampires, their nightly struggles for power and attempts to hold on to their humanity, to a format previously unexplored by the brand - an atmospheric narrative experience. Think interactive story meets choices-that-matter; dark, atmospheric, emotional narration meets Telltale-like way of creating morally challenging dilemmas, answers to which are entirely up to the players, allowing them to reach one of a variety of possible endings.

How does Coteries of New York play?
You act as a newly-fledged vampire in New York. You have to learn what it means to be one of the Kindred in a huge, vibrant, contemporary metropolis. On your way you’ll meet different NPCs – other vampires, thin-bloods, ghouls, humans... and more. You will perform tasks that will put test your humanity and take part in a complex and often brutal struggle for power between the Camarilla and the Anarchs. You’ll build your Coterie and learn your undead companions’ deepest secrets… or see them abandon you. You’ll feast on the living and will ask yourself about the very nature of humanity and will feel the constant lure of the Beast inside you. You will make choices for the character, including which storylines to pursue and how to approach the different situations presented. You will take part in a narrative experience with branching dialogue choices, memorable characters - all among iconic locales of the Big Apple. You’ll be able to use Disciplines to charm, sneak, intimidate or kill and your choices will determine your path.

If it’s called Vampire: The Masquerade, does that mean you have something in common with World of Darkness, Bloodlines 2, the cult tabletop RPG system, or...?
Yes, exactly! Coteries of New York is set in a fully licensed universe of Vampire: The Masquerade 5th Edition! However, even if you know nothing about the setting, don't fret! The game is designed to meet the expectations of both Vampire: The Masquerade veterans, and new players, who never had an opportunity to delve into the World of Darkness.

What about replayability and post-launch support?
You’ll be able to choose your character from three different vampires, representing three iconic Camarilla Clans (we’ll unveil them at a later date). Every character has access to a different set of Disciplines (unique supernatural skills that are characteristic to that Clan) and different narration. Your initial choice also influences your Coterie members’ approach to you, dialogue lines, possible side quests etc. Hence, it takes hours to experience every piece of content we prepared. You’ll go through the main quest, side quests and loyalty quests (aimed to build closer relations between the protagonist and members of your Coterie). BUT one playthrough is definitely not enough to see every piece of content we’ve prepared.

As for post-launch support, you can definitely expect new, standalone stories, enriching the lore, telling different bloody stories from the history of vampiric New York and adding new twists to interpersonal plots.

Which platforms will Coteries of New York be available on?
Coteries of New York will be available on PC (Windows, MAC OS, Linux) and Nintendo Switch. The game will launch on both platforms simultaneously. Other platforms, like PS4 and Xbox One, are not out of the question, but we're taking a "wait and see" approach.

When will Coteries of New York be released?
Coteries of New York will be released in Q4 2019! We’ll unveil the final date when we’re closer to launch.

Which language versions will be supported?
That's a huge and very difficult topic because of localisation costs and time constraints. We understand that Vampire: The Masquerade has fans all over the world and we would like Coteries of New York to be available in many different languages, including English, French, Italian, German, Spanish, Polish, Russian, Turkish, Chinese, Japanese and Brazilian Portuguese. We'll be able to share more information closer to launch.

Will the game support controllers?
Yes! As Coteries of New York will launch simultaneously on PC and Switch, you’ll be able to play the PC version both with mouse and keyboard, as well as with a controller. Full list of supported controllers will be revealed closer to launch. "
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 04, 2019, 06:36:52 pm
This sounds like it could be fun, a Telltale Games-like story taking place in the World of Darkess VTM setting, and since its being released in 2019, it can whet our appetites til Bloodlines 2 is released.  Although I looked it up on Steam and it sounds like its being developed by a different studio, "Draw Distance Games" and not Paradox, although as its "Fully licensed" they would have had to get the license from Paradox.  Its interesting that in addition to developing their own title, Paradox has licensed their property out to two different video game developers.   
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wesp5 on June 04, 2019, 06:45:47 pm
Let's just hope that these two "narrative" games are good and make people want "Bloodlines 2" even more, and that they are not as bad as the two interactive novels from the former WW which might kill any interest in more VtM games...
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: fylimar on June 04, 2019, 07:51:21 pm
It sounds quite intersting, I might try it to shorten the waiting periode until the release of Bloodlines 2
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm Streicher 19 on June 04, 2019, 08:58:23 pm
Let's just hope that these two "narrative" games are good and make people want "Bloodlines 2" even more, and that they are not as bad as the two interactive novels from the former WW which might kill any interest in more VtM games...
In my opinion is a more risky move to release this game before Bloodlines 2.
Also the developer Draw Distance don´t make me confident because i never heard about them.
Or have anyone played their newest game Ritual: Crown of Horns?

Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Nanaloma on June 04, 2019, 09:33:00 pm
Hate to be so negative but, two vampire games being released so close together in a fringe market doesn't bode well for either game. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm Streicher 19 on June 04, 2019, 09:50:00 pm
Hate to be so negative but, two vampire games being released so close together in a fringe market doesn't bode well for either game.
They are both different Genres / Games but you are right its a very strange move.
Also why has to be another Vampire: The Masquerade and not something else like a Hunter the Reckoning game?
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 04, 2019, 10:39:40 pm
Hate to be so negative but, two vampire games being released so close together in a fringe market doesn't bode well for either game.

One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm Streicher 19 on June 04, 2019, 11:11:48 pm
One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020.
Well this one release is presumedly the end of 2019 (A November release would be self-destructive. So more September, October or December)
and Bloodlines 2 launch is hopefully in March of 2020.

In my opinion this could not be enough timespace for two Vampire games. The best scenario is if
this game would be good or ok enough that it couldn´t hurt Bloodlines 2.
If it sucks well this could damage Paradox line of World of Darkness Games for the average consumer / gamer.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 04, 2019, 11:42:01 pm
One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020.
Well this one release is presumedly the end of 2019 (A November release would be self-destructive. So more September, October or December)
and Bloodlines 2 launch is hopefully in March of 2020.

In my opinion this could not be enough timespace for two Vampire games. The best scenario is if
this game would be good or ok enough that it couldn´t hurt Bloodlines 2.
If it sucks well this could damage Paradox line of World of Darkness Games for the average consumer / gamer.

Who decides these arbitrary rules?  "There can't be TWO Vampire games at the same time!!  GASP!!"  Why not?  How many sports games are there at a time?  Racing games?  First person shooters?  Obvlivion and Neverwinter Nights 2 were released fairly close together.  One didn't destroy the other. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 04, 2019, 11:42:52 pm
Let's just hope that these two "narrative" games are good and make people want "Bloodlines 2" even more, and that they are not as bad as the two interactive novels from the former WW which might kill any interest in more VtM games...
In my opinion is a more risky move to release this game before Bloodlines 2.
Also the developer Draw Distance don´t make me confident because i never heard about them.
Or have anyone played their newest game Ritual: Crown of Horns?



0:54 onward, Oregon Trail Hunting, Guitar Riff Edition! :D
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 04, 2019, 11:45:53 pm
One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020.
Well this one release is presumedly the end of 2019 (A November release would be self-destructive. So more September, October or December)
and Bloodlines 2 launch is hopefully in March of 2020.

In my opinion this could not be enough timespace for two Vampire games. The best scenario is if
this game would be good or ok enough that it couldn´t hurt Bloodlines 2.
If it sucks well this could damage Paradox line of World of Darkness Games for the average consumer / gamer.

Who decides these arbitrary rules?  "There can't be TWO Vampire games at the same time!!  GASP!!"  Why not?  How many sports games are there at a time?  Racing games?  First person shooters?  Oblivion and Neverwinter Nights 2 were released fairly close together.  One didn't destroy the other.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 04, 2019, 11:48:34 pm
One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020.
Well this one release is presumedly the end of 2019 (A November release would be self-destructive. So more September, October or December)
and Bloodlines 2 launch is hopefully in March of 2020.

In my opinion this could not be enough timespace for two Vampire games. The best scenario is if
this game would be good or ok enough that it couldn´t hurt Bloodlines 2.
If it sucks well this could damage Paradox line of World of Darkness Games for the average consumer / gamer.

Who decides these arbitrary rules?  "There can't be TWO Vampire games at the same time!!  GASP!!"  Why not?  How many sports games are there at a time?  Racing games?  First person shooters?  Oblivion and Neverwinter Nights 2 were released fairly close together.  One didn't destroy the other.

To be fair, too much of anything at once can sometimes cause supply/demand issues. Another big video game came out the same day as Bloodlines 1, and it would be naïve to say that it didn't influence what game people bought on launch day. Sure, *I* am a superior being and bought Bloodlines 1 with a pre-order and got the "slut shirt" as my friend calls it (Jeanette is on it), but the majority of gamers, when faced with which to buy first, would go with Half-Life 2 over Bloodlines 1.

Just imagine if Bloodlines 2 launched the same day as Half-Life 3. XD
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 04, 2019, 11:53:51 pm
One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020.
Well this one release is presumedly the end of 2019 (A November release would be self-destructive. So more September, October or December)
and Bloodlines 2 launch is hopefully in March of 2020.

In my opinion this could not be enough timespace for two Vampire games. The best scenario is if
this game would be good or ok enough that it couldn´t hurt Bloodlines 2.
If it sucks well this could damage Paradox line of World of Darkness Games for the average consumer / gamer.

Who decides these arbitrary rules?  "There can't be TWO Vampire games at the same time!!  GASP!!"  Why not?  How many sports games are there at a time?  Racing games?  First person shooters?  Oblivion and Neverwinter Nights 2 were released fairly close together.  One didn't destroy the other.

To be fair, too much of anything at once can sometimes cause supply/demand issues. Another big video game came out the same day as Bloodlines 1, and it would be naïve to say that it didn't influence what game people bought on launch day. Sure, *I* am a superior being and bought Bloodlines 1 with a pre-order and got the "slut shirt" as my friend calls it (Jeanette is on it), but the majority of gamers, when faced with which to buy first, would go with Half-Life 2 over Bloodlines 1.

Just imagine if Bloodlines 2 launched the same day as Half-Life 3. XD

Well if the two games were being released on the exact same day, of course that would cause problems.  But they are several months apart.  Despite DA2 disappointing several people AFTER they bought it, nobody decided to give it a pass because Skyrim was already out for 4 months. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 05, 2019, 12:02:23 am
One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020.
Well this one release is presumedly the end of 2019 (A November release would be self-destructive. So more September, October or December)
and Bloodlines 2 launch is hopefully in March of 2020.

In my opinion this could not be enough timespace for two Vampire games. The best scenario is if
this game would be good or ok enough that it couldn´t hurt Bloodlines 2.
If it sucks well this could damage Paradox line of World of Darkness Games for the average consumer / gamer.

Who decides these arbitrary rules?  "There can't be TWO Vampire games at the same time!!  GASP!!"  Why not?  How many sports games are there at a time?  Racing games?  First person shooters?  Oblivion and Neverwinter Nights 2 were released fairly close together.  One didn't destroy the other.

To be fair, too much of anything at once can sometimes cause supply/demand issues. Another big video game came out the same day as Bloodlines 1, and it would be naïve to say that it didn't influence what game people bought on launch day. Sure, *I* am a superior being and bought Bloodlines 1 with a pre-order and got the "slut shirt" as my friend calls it (Jeanette is on it), but the majority of gamers, when faced with which to buy first, would go with Half-Life 2 over Bloodlines 1.

Just imagine if Bloodlines 2 launched the same day as Half-Life 3. XD

Well if the two games were being released on the exact same day, of course that would cause problems.  But they are several months apart.  Despite DA2 disappointing several people AFTER they bought it, nobody decided to give it a pass because Skyrim was already out for 4 months.

Well, I did, but then I still haven't finished Skyrim. I think I got DA2 for like 20 bucks, tops. I was pretty wary of it. And then I paid like $40 or some shit for DA:I. I don't know what the hell I was thinking. And I got ME:A at launch. I'm like a closet masochist. I'm done with those, though. No more fooling me.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 05, 2019, 12:20:14 am
One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020.
Well this one release is presumedly the end of 2019 (A November release would be self-destructive. So more September, October or December)
and Bloodlines 2 launch is hopefully in March of 2020.

In my opinion this could not be enough timespace for two Vampire games. The best scenario is if
this game would be good or ok enough that it couldn´t hurt Bloodlines 2.
If it sucks well this could damage Paradox line of World of Darkness Games for the average consumer / gamer.

Who decides these arbitrary rules?  "There can't be TWO Vampire games at the same time!!  GASP!!"  Why not?  How many sports games are there at a time?  Racing games?  First person shooters?  Oblivion and Neverwinter Nights 2 were released fairly close together.  One didn't destroy the other.

To be fair, too much of anything at once can sometimes cause supply/demand issues. Another big video game came out the same day as Bloodlines 1, and it would be naïve to say that it didn't influence what game people bought on launch day. Sure, *I* am a superior being and bought Bloodlines 1 with a pre-order and got the "slut shirt" as my friend calls it (Jeanette is on it), but the majority of gamers, when faced with which to buy first, would go with Half-Life 2 over Bloodlines 1.

Just imagine if Bloodlines 2 launched the same day as Half-Life 3. XD

Well if the two games were being released on the exact same day, of course that would cause problems.  But they are several months apart.  Despite DA2 disappointing several people AFTER they bought it, nobody decided to give it a pass because Skyrim was already out for 4 months.

Well, I did, but then I still haven't finished Skyrim. I think I got DA2 for like 20 bucks, tops. I was pretty wary of it. And then I paid like $40 or some shit for DA:I. I don't know what the hell I was thinking. And I got ME:A at launch. I'm like a closet masochist. I'm done with those, though. No more fooling me.

Feelings about BioWare aside, when it comes to sales figures, one HIGHLY successful Fantasy RPG with elves, dragons and magic didn't mess up the financial success of another Fantasy RPG with elves, dragon and magic released merely 4 months later. That is my point.  I'm a gamer nerd who loves video games.  If they're GOOD games, I want more, not less.  I don't think the timing will be the real issue though I concede it will play a role if the Coterie game is crap.  In other words, I think the main thing will be whether or not the one released first is a good game or not.  Lets hope its good, though it being bad won't stop me from getting Bloodlines 2 but it could and probably would stop many others.  If this game proves to be crap, I can see Paradox delaying Bloodlines 2's release by several months or more and that's where timing being an issue will certainly come into play. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 05, 2019, 12:25:24 am
One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020.
Well this one release is presumedly the end of 2019 (A November release would be self-destructive. So more September, October or December)
and Bloodlines 2 launch is hopefully in March of 2020.

In my opinion this could not be enough timespace for two Vampire games. The best scenario is if
this game would be good or ok enough that it couldn´t hurt Bloodlines 2.
If it sucks well this could damage Paradox line of World of Darkness Games for the average consumer / gamer.

Who decides these arbitrary rules?  "There can't be TWO Vampire games at the same time!!  GASP!!"  Why not?  How many sports games are there at a time?  Racing games?  First person shooters?  Oblivion and Neverwinter Nights 2 were released fairly close together.  One didn't destroy the other.

To be fair, too much of anything at once can sometimes cause supply/demand issues. Another big video game came out the same day as Bloodlines 1, and it would be naïve to say that it didn't influence what game people bought on launch day. Sure, *I* am a superior being and bought Bloodlines 1 with a pre-order and got the "slut shirt" as my friend calls it (Jeanette is on it), but the majority of gamers, when faced with which to buy first, would go with Half-Life 2 over Bloodlines 1.

Just imagine if Bloodlines 2 launched the same day as Half-Life 3. XD

Well if the two games were being released on the exact same day, of course that would cause problems.  But they are several months apart.  Despite DA2 disappointing several people AFTER they bought it, nobody decided to give it a pass because Skyrim was already out for 4 months.

Well, I did, but then I still haven't finished Skyrim. I think I got DA2 for like 20 bucks, tops. I was pretty wary of it. And then I paid like $40 or some shit for DA:I. I don't know what the hell I was thinking. And I got ME:A at launch. I'm like a closet masochist. I'm done with those, though. No more fooling me.

Feelings about BioWare aside, when it comes to sales figures, one HIGHLY successful Fantasy RPG with elves, dragons and magic didn't mess up the financial success of another Fantasy RPG with elves, dragon and magic released merely 4 months later. That is my point.  I'm a gamer nerd who loves video games.  If they're GOOD games, I want more, not less.  I don't think the timing will be the real issue though I concede it will play a role if the Coterie game is crap.  In other words, I think the main thing will be whether or not the one released first is a good game or not.  Lets hope its good, though it being bad won't stop me from getting Bloodlines 2 but it could and probably would stop many others.  If this game proves to be crap, I can see Paradox delaying Bloodlines 2's release by several months or more and that's where timing being an issue will certainly come into play.

If the 2019 VtM game is a stinky turd, it had best not sully Bloodlines 2's sales figures. Bloodlines 2 is my favorite game, so a lot is riding on Bloodlines 2 for me. I would love a new game that makes me swoon like the original
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 05, 2019, 12:32:47 am
One is being released in 2019 and the other in 2020.
Well this one release is presumedly the end of 2019 (A November release would be self-destructive. So more September, October or December)
and Bloodlines 2 launch is hopefully in March of 2020.

In my opinion this could not be enough timespace for two Vampire games. The best scenario is if
this game would be good or ok enough that it couldn´t hurt Bloodlines 2.
If it sucks well this could damage Paradox line of World of Darkness Games for the average consumer / gamer.

Who decides these arbitrary rules?  "There can't be TWO Vampire games at the same time!!  GASP!!"  Why not?  How many sports games are there at a time?  Racing games?  First person shooters?  Oblivion and Neverwinter Nights 2 were released fairly close together.  One didn't destroy the other.

To be fair, too much of anything at once can sometimes cause supply/demand issues. Another big video game came out the same day as Bloodlines 1, and it would be naïve to say that it didn't influence what game people bought on launch day. Sure, *I* am a superior being and bought Bloodlines 1 with a pre-order and got the "slut shirt" as my friend calls it (Jeanette is on it), but the majority of gamers, when faced with which to buy first, would go with Half-Life 2 over Bloodlines 1.

Just imagine if Bloodlines 2 launched the same day as Half-Life 3. XD

Well if the two games were being released on the exact same day, of course that would cause problems.  But they are several months apart.  Despite DA2 disappointing several people AFTER they bought it, nobody decided to give it a pass because Skyrim was already out for 4 months.

Well, I did, but then I still haven't finished Skyrim. I think I got DA2 for like 20 bucks, tops. I was pretty wary of it. And then I paid like $40 or some shit for DA:I. I don't know what the hell I was thinking. And I got ME:A at launch. I'm like a closet masochist. I'm done with those, though. No more fooling me.

Feelings about BioWare aside, when it comes to sales figures, one HIGHLY successful Fantasy RPG with elves, dragons and magic didn't mess up the financial success of another Fantasy RPG with elves, dragon and magic released merely 4 months later. That is my point.  I'm a gamer nerd who loves video games.  If they're GOOD games, I want more, not less.  I don't think the timing will be the real issue though I concede it will play a role if the Coterie game is crap.  In other words, I think the main thing will be whether or not the one released first is a good game or not.  Lets hope its good, though it being bad won't stop me from getting Bloodlines 2 but it could and probably would stop many others.  If this game proves to be crap, I can see Paradox delaying Bloodlines 2's release by several months or more and that's where timing being an issue will certainly come into play.

If the 2019 VtM game is a stinky turd, it had best not sully Bloodlines 2's sales figures. Bloodlines 2 is my favorite game, so a lot is riding on Bloodlines 2 for me. I would love a new game that makes me swoon like the original

For now, I don't think we should fret. There's no reason to think Draw Distance will do a terrible job.  Their early access game "Ritual: Crown of Horns" hasn't been available to play for very long but it seems like those who do play it overall seem to enjoy it, so far with only one negative review as of yet.  Really all we can do is wait and see.  If Coteries of New York is good, this will be an excellent thing.   
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: mdqp on June 05, 2019, 09:40:13 am
Did they officially state the game's genre? I always think about point & click adventure or visual novels when narrative experience is the main descriptor, but it also talks about quests, so I am not quite sure, maybe it's an adventure/RPG hybrid (kind of like gamebooks, if the narrative part is more prevalent)?

It's all potentially interesting, but it seems pointless to speculate for now, since it's a completely new game.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 05, 2019, 09:51:00 am
Did they officially state the game's genre? I always think about point & click adventure or visual novels when narrative experience is the main descriptor, but it also talks about quests, so I am not quite sure, maybe it's an adventure/RPG hybrid (kind of like gamebooks, if the narrative part is more prevalent)?

It's all potentially interesting, but it seems pointless to speculate for now, since it's a completely new game.

They describe it as being similar to a Telltale game title, so I am thinking in my head that it will be one of those narrative games that has a bit of an animated comic book feel like "Wolf Among Us" or "The Walking Dead". 

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/R/L/7zRLZ/fables-review-screen-2.0_l.jpg)(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/R/L/7zRLY/dims_l.jpg)
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: mdqp on June 05, 2019, 11:45:37 am
They describe it as being similar to a Telltale game title, so I am thinking in my head that it will be one of those narrative games that has a bit of an animated comic book feel like "Wolf Among Us" or "The Walking Dead". 

A Telltale game with a bit more gameplay (that isn't QTEs) and more choices and consequences would be cool. I was kind of disappointed by how little the choices mattered in TWD season 1, so it kind of put me off buying any of their other games (in the same style).
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 05, 2019, 11:49:42 am
They describe it as being similar to a Telltale game title, so I am thinking in my head that it will be one of those narrative games that has a bit of an animated comic book feel like "Wolf Among Us" or "The Walking Dead". 

A Telltale game with a bit more gameplay (that isn't QTEs) and more choices and consequences would be cool. I was kind of disappointed by how little the choices mattered in TWD season 1, so it kind of put me off buying any of their other games (in the same style).

It sounds like they want to keep adding to the game if its successful, so it may be a bit more elaborate than a basic Telltale game. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 05, 2019, 08:08:44 pm
Did they officially state the game's genre? I always think about point & click adventure or visual novels when narrative experience is the main descriptor, but it also talks about quests, so I am not quite sure, maybe it's an adventure/RPG hybrid (kind of like gamebooks, if the narrative part is more prevalent)?

It's all potentially interesting, but it seems pointless to speculate for now, since it's a completely new game.

They describe it as being similar to a Telltale game title, so I am thinking in my head that it will be one of those narrative games that has a bit of an animated comic book feel like "Wolf Among Us" or "The Walking Dead". 

(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/R/L/7zRLZ/fables-review-screen-2.0_l.jpg)(https://ist5-2.filesor.com/pimpandhost.com/2/0/5/1/20516/7/z/R/L/7zRLY/dims_l.jpg)


They have my curiosity, but not my attention quite yet. I didn't like The Wolf Among Us, and Telltale I guess shifted focus in the third season to some other family with Clem as more of a side character, I guess? I prefer Clementine over Bob Ross Jr. in the backseat there. =/  I stopped after Season 2 was done and never touched it again.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 06, 2019, 01:07:02 am
They have my curiosity, but not my attention quite yet. I didn't like The Wolf Among Us, and Telltale I guess shifted focus in the third season to some other family with Clem as more of a side character, I guess? I prefer Clementine over Bob Ross Jr. in the backseat there. =/  I stopped after Season 2 was done and never touched it again.

Give it a chance, Season 3 was pretty great and things did seem to get back on track in Season 4.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: argikt on June 06, 2019, 07:43:22 am
https://es.ign.com/vampire-the-masquerade-coteries-of-new-york

launching 4Q 2019
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: z on June 06, 2019, 07:46:14 am
I don't even have a Nintendo... T______T

F
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: fylimar on June 06, 2019, 08:20:26 am
There is already a thread for that game here
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: argikt on June 06, 2019, 08:23:16 am
I don't even have a Nintendo... T______T

F

Also in PC
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm Streicher 19 on June 06, 2019, 09:00:54 am
There is already a thread for that game here
Exactly we don´t two threads for this game so can the mods please close this thread? Thanks. :)

So i am a bit perplex who anyone could overlook the existing thread.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Barabbah on June 06, 2019, 09:27:52 am
Like that 2nd thread on character speculation. For an admin it's possible to merge topics?
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: mdqp on June 06, 2019, 09:39:28 am
It sounds like they want to keep adding to the game if its successful, so it may be a bit more elaborate than a basic Telltale game.

I think that would hit the sweet spot for me, since I found TWD a little too light on the gameplay side, hopefully I'll be able to learn more in the future, and decide whether or not it's something for me. Not that I am in any hurry to buy new games, my backlog is huge already. XD
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm Streicher 19 on June 06, 2019, 09:44:31 am
Like that 2nd thread on character speculation. For an admin it's possible to merge topics?
You mean Grout? This should a seperate thread because in my opinion its an interessing and unique topic
which deserves its own thread.

But this one? We clearly don´t need two threads about Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 06, 2019, 10:03:52 am
It sounds like they want to keep adding to the game if its successful, so it may be a bit more elaborate than a basic Telltale game.

I think that would hit the sweet spot for me, since I found TWD a little too light on the gameplay side, hopefully I'll be able to learn more in the future, and decide whether or not it's something for me. Not that I am in any hurry to buy new games, my backlog is huge already. XD

I'm certainly in a hurry.  I do have some games I need to play yet.  "Technomancer" has been sitting in my Steam library for awhile now, the new "Call of Cthulhu" and "Vampyr", but they won't last me a year. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wesp5 on June 06, 2019, 11:34:14 am
Just for your info, I have merged the two topics about this game now.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 07, 2019, 06:29:53 am
It sounds like they want to keep adding to the game if its successful, so it may be a bit more elaborate than a basic Telltale game.

I think that would hit the sweet spot for me, since I found TWD a little too light on the gameplay side, hopefully I'll be able to learn more in the future, and decide whether or not it's something for me. Not that I am in any hurry to buy new games, my backlog is huge already. XD

I'm certainly in a hurry.  I do have some games I need to play yet.  "Technomancer" has been sitting in my Steam library for awhile now, the new "Call of Cthulhu" and "Vampyr", but they won't last me a year.

I just played Technomancer the other day for the first time. Meh. To be fair, though, I am The Princess and the Pea with games, though. If you are fine with half-assed stuff, you might like it. That's not a dig on you, of course (well, the elitist part of me does a rich person laugh and an eye-roll), but it's more of a pro for you because it means you can enjoy games I never could, potentially.

My biggest gripe about Technomancer from the like...3-4 hours I could stomach it, is just the world. It SEEMS like an interesting world based on the information they give you, but the characters and maps are spready out too much. Imagine if Bloodlines 1 took Santa Monica, had the same number of RELEVANT places and characters, then spread everything and everyone out across an area like 5x the size of the current in-game Santa Monica. And of course, you're on foot, so no, there's no cool transportation to make the travel un-fun.

So basically they BS the world's size and scope by just making the maps big. Perhaps it doesn't persist through all towns, but the first city you hit...it was an instant deal-breaker for me.

I want to like Cthulhu stuff, but I hate the idea of going crazy if you figure the plot out. Getting a bad ending for understanding WTF happened is annoying, so I've yet to pick that game up. Also, I can't seem to get into that setting. Basically everyone in those games just act like Silent Hill butthole townspeople who want to be vague and keep secrets by giving you shitty looks or trying to kill you with random fish people. Just setting it in the 1920s or whenever doesn't automatically get my thumbs up. I need stuff to INTEREST me, and it ain't doing it. =/

Vampyr. Ohoho, FUCK Vampyr. I hate that game so much. Its characters are trash and like two different characters said stuff about being "a strong, independent woman" because the writers don't know how to write strong, independent women. They just make memes of outspoken bitches and call them token SJW phrases instead of ACTUALLY making awesome women who are powerful. I didn't need someone to say the magic words for Lara Croft to start kicking ass and taking names in the Tomb Raider reboot. These SJW brownie point slogan things are just silly and cheapen the writing. Show, don't tell. Jeez.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wesp5 on June 07, 2019, 08:46:23 am
I want to like Cthulhu stuff, but I hate the idea of going crazy if you figure the plot out.

Besides that, the last "Call of Chtulhu" game was a boring walking simulator and can hardly be called a game!

Quote
Vampyr. Ohoho, FUCK Vampyr. I hate that game so much. Its characters are trash and like two different characters said stuff about being "a strong, independent woman" because the writers don't know how to write strong, independent women.

I completely agree! Also all the bullshit with the player eating anyone alive while fighting and then being a pussy when talking with NPCs. That is one vampire game that didn't get the difference between being a monster and keeping your humanity.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 07, 2019, 10:09:44 am
I just played Technomancer the other day for the first time. Meh. To be fair, though, I am The Princess and the Pea with games, though. If you are fine with half-assed stuff, you might like it. That's not a dig on you, of course (well, the elitist part of me does a rich person laugh and an eye-roll), but it's more of a pro for you because it means you can enjoy games I never could, potentially.

My biggest gripe about Technomancer from the like...3-4 hours I could stomach it, is just the world. It SEEMS like an interesting world based on the information they give you, but the characters and maps are spready out too much. Imagine if Bloodlines 1 took Santa Monica, had the same number of RELEVANT places and characters, then spread everything and everyone out across an area like 5x the size of the current in-game Santa Monica. And of course, you're on foot, so no, there's no cool transportation to make the travel un-fun.

So basically they BS the world's size and scope by just making the maps big. Perhaps it doesn't persist through all towns, but the first city you hit...it was an instant deal-breaker for me.

I want to like Cthulhu stuff, but I hate the idea of going crazy if you figure the plot out. Getting a bad ending for understanding WTF happened is annoying, so I've yet to pick that game up. Also, I can't seem to get into that setting. Basically everyone in those games just act like Silent Hill butthole townspeople who want to be vague and keep secrets by giving you shitty looks or trying to kill you with random fish people. Just setting it in the 1920s or whenever doesn't automatically get my thumbs up. I need stuff to INTEREST me, and it ain't doing it. =/

Vampyr. Ohoho, FUCK Vampyr. I hate that game so much. Its characters are trash and like two different characters said stuff about being "a strong, independent woman" because the writers don't know how to write strong, independent women. They just make memes of outspoken bitches and call them token SJW phrases instead of ACTUALLY making awesome women who are powerful. I didn't need someone to say the magic words for Lara Croft to start kicking ass and taking names in the Tomb Raider reboot. These SJW brownie point slogan things are just silly and cheapen the writing. Show, don't tell. Jeez.

I appreciate that you have given me your take on these games, I do still intend to form my own opinion about them however.  lol

I don't know if I am easier to please than you are but its possible that different types of things annoy us about video games (or TV shows).  I might roll my eyes at "I am a strong independent woman!!" if I come across it in a game, but it won't utterly destroy the game for me.  I remember in Skyrim that Nord woman Olfina or whatever that kept saying "What's the Matter!  Can't stand the sight of a strong Nord woman??"  Then when danger actually showed up, she ran around cowering.  I thought it was hilarious.  I HAAATED several aspects of the Witcher series (OMG Dethmold the Depraved Gay lol) but over all I adore the franchise and looked past the things that bugged me.  I know eventually they will make a 4th one and I can't wait for it. 

Here's a gal who shows rather than says, for ya!  :D
(https://media.giphy.com/media/H4ceVeyDyeZ9AGbwJK/giphy.gif)

Besides that, the last "Call of Chtulhu" game was a boring walking simulator and can hardly be called a game!

You mean "Call of Cthulhu: Dark Corners of the Earth"?
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wesp5 on June 07, 2019, 12:16:13 pm
You mean "Call of Cthulhu: Dark Corners of the Earth"?

No, if I remember correctly this was a decent game. I meant the new one just called "Call of Cthulhu" from last year!
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 07, 2019, 12:18:53 pm
You mean "Call of Cthulhu: Dark Corners of the Earth"?

No, if I remember correctly this was a decent game. I meant the new one just called "Call of Cthulhu" from last year!

Ah!  Yes that is the one I haven't played yet, I really enjoyed Dark Corners of the Earth. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: fylimar on June 07, 2019, 02:36:22 pm
I love Cthulhu games, for PC and p&p. Having the own character going crazy over time, is what makes it interesting for me, but then, I'm a big Lovecraft fan.
I'm anxiously awaiting the Sinking City.

Oh and totally unrelated, but because there are so many Baldurs Gate fans here:BG 3 is coming (2 had vampires in it, so not totally off topic ;))
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 07, 2019, 02:47:22 pm
I love Cthulhu games, for PC and p&p. Having the own character going crazy over time, is what makes it interesting for me, but then, I'm a big Lovecraft fan.
I'm anxiously awaiting the Sinking City.

Oh and totally unrelated, but because there are so many Baldurs Gate fans here:BG 3 is coming (2 had vampires in it, so not totally off topic ;))

That is still happening?  Fantastic! 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: fylimar on June 07, 2019, 05:08:20 pm
I love Cthulhu games, for PC and p&p. Having the own character going crazy over time, is what makes it interesting for me, but then, I'm a big Lovecraft fan.
I'm anxiously awaiting the Sinking City.

Oh and totally unrelated, but because there are so many Baldurs Gate fans here:BG 3 is coming (2 had vampires in it, so not totally off topic ;))

That is still happening?  Fantastic!
Yeeeess
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 07, 2019, 06:04:50 pm
I love Cthulhu games, for PC and p&p. Having the own character going crazy over time, is what makes it interesting for me, but then, I'm a big Lovecraft fan.
I'm anxiously awaiting the Sinking City.

Oh and totally unrelated, but because there are so many Baldurs Gate fans here:BG 3 is coming (2 had vampires in it, so not totally off topic ;))

That is still happening?  Fantastic!
Yeeeess

(https://media1.giphy.com/media/l0Ex3dSWLMNkiFyEM/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 07, 2019, 11:45:26 pm
I just played Technomancer the other day for the first time. Meh. To be fair, though, I am The Princess and the Pea with games, though. If you are fine with half-assed stuff, you might like it. That's not a dig on you, of course (well, the elitist part of me does a rich person laugh and an eye-roll), but it's more of a pro for you because it means you can enjoy games I never could, potentially.

My biggest gripe about Technomancer from the like...3-4 hours I could stomach it, is just the world. It SEEMS like an interesting world based on the information they give you, but the characters and maps are spready out too much. Imagine if Bloodlines 1 took Santa Monica, had the same number of RELEVANT places and characters, then spread everything and everyone out across an area like 5x the size of the current in-game Santa Monica. And of course, you're on foot, so no, there's no cool transportation to make the travel un-fun.

So basically they BS the world's size and scope by just making the maps big. Perhaps it doesn't persist through all towns, but the first city you hit...it was an instant deal-breaker for me.

I want to like Cthulhu stuff, but I hate the idea of going crazy if you figure the plot out. Getting a bad ending for understanding WTF happened is annoying, so I've yet to pick that game up. Also, I can't seem to get into that setting. Basically everyone in those games just act like Silent Hill butthole townspeople who want to be vague and keep secrets by giving you shitty looks or trying to kill you with random fish people. Just setting it in the 1920s or whenever doesn't automatically get my thumbs up. I need stuff to INTEREST me, and it ain't doing it. =/

Vampyr. Ohoho, FUCK Vampyr. I hate that game so much. Its characters are trash and like two different characters said stuff about being "a strong, independent woman" because the writers don't know how to write strong, independent women. They just make memes of outspoken bitches and call them token SJW phrases instead of ACTUALLY making awesome women who are powerful. I didn't need someone to say the magic words for Lara Croft to start kicking ass and taking names in the Tomb Raider reboot. These SJW brownie point slogan things are just silly and cheapen the writing. Show, don't tell. Jeez.

I appreciate that you have given me your take on these games, I do still intend to form my own opinion about them however.  lol

I don't know if I am easier to please than you are but its possible that different types of things annoy us about video games (or TV shows).  I might roll my eyes at "I am a strong independent woman!!" if I come across it in a game, but it won't utterly destroy the game for me.  I remember in Skyrim that Nord woman Olfina or whatever that kept saying "What's the Matter!  Can't stand the sight of a strong Nord woman??"  Then when danger actually showed up, she ran around cowering.  I thought it was hilarious.  I HAAATED several aspects of the Witcher series (OMG Dethmold the Depraved Gay lol) but over all I adore the franchise and looked past the things that bugged me.  I know eventually they will make a 4th one and I can't wait for it. 

Here's a gal who shows rather than says, for ya!  :D
(https://media.giphy.com/media/H4ceVeyDyeZ9AGbwJK/giphy.gif)

Besides that, the last "Call of Chtulhu" game was a boring walking simulator and can hardly be called a game!

You mean "Call of Cthulhu: Dark Corners of the Earth"?

Haha, but of course. What it's going to come down to is "do the things I pointed out suck enough to put you off when you're playing?" If not, you might have a good time, but if those are deal-breakers for you, you're gonna have a bad time. I didn't even mention the difficulty on Technomancer. Not very well-balanced and makes you feel like a little bitch despite being a lightning mage with combat training and two allies. =p

Vampyr wasn't ruined for me by two or so alleged "strong, independent woman" types (they were just bitches being bitches, as opposed to womanfolk of strong character). You would think that people never heard of Lara Croft, Sarah Kerrigan, Jade (Beyond Good & Evil), Samus Aran, most cool chicks in Bloodlines 1, and so forth, because these devs and journalists' social justice-y lives are meaningless until they can scream "strong, independent woman" about all female characters. And let's talk about Sarah Kerrigan from StarCraft. I'll bet some dumbass would contend she's not "independent" because she's in love with one of those filthy MANfolk things. Um...loving another person does not make you dependent. She's literally the most powerful playable character in the entire StarCraft universe. O_o

Wait, wait, WAIT. "Dethmold the Depraved Gay?" Was this in The Witcher 3? I wasn't going to get it because I never finished The Witcher 2, but if I'm missing out on crazy shit like that, maybe I should sign up. Did they REALLY call him that in the game, too?! "The Depraved Gay?!" That's so dumb and so hilarious all at once. Can Geralt romance him?!?! :O  I don't want those weaksauce pervy animations with romantic and sexual undertones. I want this guy doing some KINKY shit and Geralt to be like "WTF did I get myself into?! I forgot the safe word!" Meanwhile, Triss Merigold is watching from outside through the window, fogging up the glass while she breathes heavily, chin down, eyes up, making her best "me gusta" face.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 12:07:56 am
Haha, but of course. What it's going to come down to is "do the things I pointed out suck enough to put you off when you're playing?" If not, you might have a good time, but if those are deal-breakers for you, you're gonna have a bad time. I didn't even mention the difficulty on Technomancer. Not very well-balanced and makes you feel like a little bitch despite being a lightning mage with combat training and two allies. =p

Vampyr wasn't ruined for me by two or so alleged "strong, independent woman" types (they were just bitches being bitches, as opposed to womanfolk of strong character). You would think that people never heard of Lara Croft, Sarah Kerrigan, Jade (Beyond Good & Evil), Samus Aran, most cool chicks in Bloodlines 1, and so forth, because these devs and journalists' social justice-y lives are meaningless until they can scream "strong, independent woman" about all female characters. And let's talk about Sarah Kerrigan from StarCraft. I'll bet some dumbass would contend she's not "independent" because she's in love with one of those filthy MANfolk things. Um...loving another person does not make you dependent. She's literally the most powerful playable character in the entire StarCraft universe. O_o

Wait, wait, WAIT. "Dethmold the Depraved Gay?" Was this in The Witcher 3? I wasn't going to get it because I never finished The Witcher 2, but if I'm missing out on crazy shit like that, maybe I should sign up. Did they REALLY call him that in the game, too?! "The Depraved Gay?!" That's so dumb and so hilarious all at once. Can Geralt romance him?!?! :O  I don't want those weaksauce pervy animations with romantic and sexual undertones. I want this guy doing some KINKY shit and Geralt to be like "WTF did I get myself into?! I forgot the safe word!" Meanwhile, Triss Merigold is watching from outside through the window, fogging up the glass while she breathes heavily, chin down, eyes up, making her best "me gusta" face.

No, they didn't call him "The Depraved Gay" in the game.  lol  I was paraphrasing the name of the trope he fits "Depraved Homosexual" and it was in part 2.  Perhaps you didn't make it to that part of the game (and you only do if you make a certain choice) but near the end its revealed that he is gay, he is evil, he keeps what appear to be male slaves that he has sex with, possibly through coercion (it is not shown on screen) and he has sexual torture devices that he apparently is about to use on a dude slave that Geralt and Roche catch him with.  Suddenly he is a cowering, whimpering bitch despite being shown as a fairly fearless magical bad ass earlier in the game, instead of USING his powerful magic to defend himself, he feebly reaches for a sword that is easily batted away from him as his arm is quite effortlessly broken, he squeals about his precious arm being broken, starts screaming and begging for his life in a high pitched bitch whine and ultimately gets castrated and his throat slit by Roche without ever successfully defending himself. 

So yeah, not one of my favorite characters in The Witcher series.  lol 

Dethmold is actually mentioned on the "Depraved Homosexual" TV Trope page under the video games example section:
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DepravedHomosexual
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 08, 2019, 02:36:12 am
Oh and totally unrelated, but because there are so many Baldurs Gate fans here:BG 3 is coming (2 had vampires in it, so not totally off topic ;))

Totally my next project by the way. I've never played Baldur's Gate before... didn't know it had vampires as well !
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 03:14:14 am
Oh and totally unrelated, but because there are so many Baldurs Gate fans here:BG 3 is coming (2 had vampires in it, so not totally off topic ;))

Totally my next project by the way. I've never played Baldur's Gate before... didn't know it had vampires as well !

You are in for an EPIC treat.  Especially with Baldur's Gate II.  But there are mods that can make part 1 a truly fantastic and lively experience as well.

Some links you will need:

http://www.pocketplane.net/mambo/

https://www.gibberlings3.net/

http://www.shsforums.net/

If you get the old versions, I recommend you use Baldur's Gate TuTu.  TuTu will not be needed if you use the enhanced editions. 

And yes, vampires play a large role in Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn.  Most definitely. 

(https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/forgottenrealms/images/e/e6/Bodhi.png/revision/latest?cb=20180520135654)
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 08, 2019, 03:33:39 am
What about the Enhanced Editions ?
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 08, 2019, 04:02:28 am
Oh and totally unrelated, but because there are so many Baldurs Gate fans here:BG 3 is coming (2 had vampires in it, so not totally off topic ;))

Totally my next project by the way. I've never played Baldur's Gate before... didn't know it had vampires as well !

You are in for an EPIC treat.  Especially with Baldur's Gate II.  But there are mods that can make part 1 a truly fantastic and lively experience as well.

Some links you will need:

http://www.pocketplane.net/mambo/

https://www.gibberlings3.net/

http://www.shsforums.net/

If you get the old versions, I recommend you use Baldur's Gate TuTu.  TuTu will not be needed if you use the enhanced editions. 

And yes, vampires play a large role in Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn.  Most definitely. 

(https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/forgottenrealms/images/e/e6/Bodhi.png/revision/latest?cb=20180520135654)

I loaded up the first BG one time a few years ago, cringed at its appearance, then closed it. For a game to be THAT fugly, it had better blow my mind with its setting, like PlaneScape: Torment. BG is set in Faerun...and Faerun is some meh fantasy stuff for me, though I do like vampires and Illithid (mindflayers). However...vampires in D&D 3.0 and older (which is what BG is) don't interest me. I love vampires so long as there is a conflict of morality for the vampire. Otherwise, they're just mildly entertaining. It's why VtM is the greatest vampire lore in my opinion. It's all about dealing with your morality as a powerful creature capable of AND encouraged to do horrible things.

In D&D it just seems like "Rawr, gonna kill ya." That's fun in The Lost Boys because it's like 90 minutes of blissful action, '80s comedy, and gore. However, pure evil douchebags without likable/relatable ones really bore me, so I don't think I'd be able to sit through D&D vampires.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 05:51:30 am
What about the Enhanced Editions ?

Yes, vampires still play a role in the Enhanced Editions and you can still use most of the mods as most of then have been updated for the Enhanced Editions.  You won't need TuTu if you use the Enhanced Editions though. 

I loaded up the first BG one time a few years ago, cringed at its appearance, then closed it. For a game to be THAT fugly, it had better blow my mind with its setting, like PlaneScape: Torment. BG is set in Faerun...and Faerun is some meh fantasy stuff for me, though I do like vampires and Illithid (mindflayers). However...vampires in D&D 3.0 and older (which is what BG is) don't interest me. I love vampires so long as there is a conflict of morality for the vampire. Otherwise, they're just mildly entertaining. It's why VtM is the greatest vampire lore in my opinion. It's all about dealing with your morality as a powerful creature capable of AND encouraged to do horrible things.

In D&D it just seems like "Rawr, gonna kill ya." That's fun in The Lost Boys because it's like 90 minutes of blissful action, '80s comedy, and gore. However, pure evil douchebags without likable/relatable ones really bore me, so I don't think I'd be able to sit through D&D vampires.

I wouldn't call it "fugly", I would call it old and a product of its time.  And the look could have been updated using the Baldur's Gate TuTu mod which causes Baldur's Gate 1 to use the updated engine of Baldur's Gate II.  I will confess that I played Baldur's Gate II first and it was my love of that game that made me snatch part 1 the very first moment I could.  And yes, I was super disappointed in how it looked compared to its sequel, but on a hunch I googled for a mod that would change that and low and behold I found it in Baldur's Gate TuTu.  After that I was able to quite enjoy part 1.  But if he plays the Enhanced Editions, it won't be necessary because things in that respect are enhanced right out of the box without the use of mods and it comes with additional story elements and companion NPCs.  And if Highway didn't have a problem with the 2D isometric graphics of Arcanum, he certainly won't have a problem with them in relation to the Baldur's Gate series. Some people don't need wonderful graphics to enjoy an RPG, they just need really good story and choice.  The Baldur's Gate series offers this which can be further enhanced with absolutely wonderful mods.   And for me, D&D 3.0 remains my favorite.  I am disgusted with what happened to the setting with 4.0.  I hope 5.0 is an improvement as I have not been back to the setting since before the preposterous "Spellplague" unless you count the times I have replayed older games like BG 1 and 2 and NWN 1 and 2.

At any rate, the vampires of BGII aren't just the "rawr!!!" kind.  The picture I posted is of the Vampiress Bodhi.  She is much more than a growling monster.   
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 08, 2019, 06:56:37 am
What about the Enhanced Editions ?

Yes, vampires still play a role in the Enhanced Editions and you can still use most of the mods as most of then have been updated for the Enhanced Editions.  You won't need TuTu if you use the Enhanced Editions though. 

I loaded up the first BG one time a few years ago, cringed at its appearance, then closed it. For a game to be THAT fugly, it had better blow my mind with its setting, like PlaneScape: Torment. BG is set in Faerun...and Faerun is some meh fantasy stuff for me, though I do like vampires and Illithid (mindflayers). However...vampires in D&D 3.0 and older (which is what BG is) don't interest me. I love vampires so long as there is a conflict of morality for the vampire. Otherwise, they're just mildly entertaining. It's why VtM is the greatest vampire lore in my opinion. It's all about dealing with your morality as a powerful creature capable of AND encouraged to do horrible things.

In D&D it just seems like "Rawr, gonna kill ya." That's fun in The Lost Boys because it's like 90 minutes of blissful action, '80s comedy, and gore. However, pure evil douchebags without likable/relatable ones really bore me, so I don't think I'd be able to sit through D&D vampires.

I wouldn't call it "fugly", I would call it old and a product of its time.  And the look could have been updated using the Baldur's Gate TuTu mod which causes Baldur's Gate 1 to use the updated engine of Baldur's Gate II.  I will confess that I played Baldur's Gate II first and it was my love of that game that made me snatch part 1 the very first moment I could.  And yes, I was super disappointed in how it looked compared to its sequel, but on a hunch I googled for a mod that would change that and low and behold I found it in Baldur's Gate TuTu.  After that I was able to quite enjoy part 1.  But if he plays the Enhanced Editions, it won't be necessary because things in that respect are enhanced right out of the box without the use of mods and it comes with additional story elements and companion NPCs.  And if Highway didn't have a problem with the 2D isometric graphics of Arcanum, he certainly won't have a problem with them in relation to the Baldur's Gate series. Some people don't need wonderful graphics to enjoy an RPG, they just need really good story and choice.  The Baldur's Gate series offers this which can be further enhanced with absolutely wonderful mods.   And for me, D&D 3.0 remains my favorite.  I am disgusted with what happened to the setting with 4.0.  I hope 5.0 is an improvement as I have not been back to the setting since before the preposterous "Spellplague" unless you count the times I have replayed older games like BG 1 and 2 and NWN 1 and 2.

At any rate, the vampires of BGII aren't just the "rawr!!!" kind.  The picture I posted is of the Vampiress Bodhi.  She is much more than a growling monster.   

If I ever play it, I'll hafta look into mods.

I do like Bodhi's body (huehuehue~), but I don't think I can get into D&D. The only fantasy stuff I ever really liked was King's Quest and LotR, and the former was just because I was a kid and liked tons of stuff. Had I found it now, I probably wouldn't pay it any heed. Fantasy is so hard for me to relate to because the characters are all so survival-oriented and dedicated to factions that don't exist in our world. I wouldn't want to live in that world and wouldn't have any aspirations if I did, other than "don't die."

I would love to like fantasy, but wow do I have a hard time caring. I played Divinity Original Sin for a couple of hours and never went back. Not one thing intrigued me and it's supposed to be over 100 hours long. UGH. Portal is like 3 hours long and rocked my world. When games are too long, they leave me butthurt, but when they're small and filled with goodness, they leave me begging for more.



Giggity.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 07:14:04 am
If I ever play it, I'll hafta look into mods.

I do like Bodhi's body (huehuehue~), but I don't think I can get into D&D. The only fantasy stuff I ever really liked was King's Quest and LotR, and the former was just because I was a kid and liked tons of stuff. Had I found it now, I probably wouldn't pay it any heed. Fantasy is so hard for me to relate to because the characters are all so survival-oriented and dedicated to factions that don't exist in our world. I wouldn't want to live in that world and wouldn't have any aspirations if I did, other than "don't die."

I would love to like fantasy, but wow do I have a hard time caring. I played Divinity Original Sin for a couple of hours and never went back. Not one thing intrigued me and it's supposed to be over 100 hours long. UGH. Portal is like 3 hours long and rocked my world. When games are too long, they leave me butthurt, but when they're small and filled with goodness, they leave me begging for more.



Giggity.

I can understand not enjoying the game if you aren't into Fantasy.  I find pleasure in various RPG settings, so it doesn't always have to be fantasy but it certainly can be.  But I love space operas as well, and post apocalyptic worlds and contemporary settings.  I like horror and science fiction as well.

I definitely prefer the larger, longer, more elaborate games though.  If a game is too simple, I might not enjoy it with the exception of early arcade games, Tetris and PC hearts.  lol
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: fylimar on June 08, 2019, 10:05:13 am
Oh and totally unrelated, but because there are so many Baldurs Gate fans here:BG 3 is coming (2 had vampires in it, so not totally off topic ;))

Totally my next project by the way. I've never played Baldur's Gate before... didn't know it had vampires as well !

Great games. Part 2  has vampires in it. But you can't play them
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 10:11:52 am
Oh and totally unrelated, but because there are so many Baldurs Gate fans here:BG 3 is coming (2 had vampires in it, so not totally off topic ;))

Totally my next project by the way. I've never played Baldur's Gate before... didn't know it had vampires as well !

Great games. Part 2  has vampires in it. But you can't play them

Although I used a vampire avatar for my first BG character ever.  Actually I would call her my first RPG character ever.  And I colored her sprite to match. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 08, 2019, 11:04:54 am
If I ever play it, I'll hafta look into mods.

I do like Bodhi's body (huehuehue~), but I don't think I can get into D&D. The only fantasy stuff I ever really liked was King's Quest and LotR, and the former was just because I was a kid and liked tons of stuff. Had I found it now, I probably wouldn't pay it any heed. Fantasy is so hard for me to relate to because the characters are all so survival-oriented and dedicated to factions that don't exist in our world. I wouldn't want to live in that world and wouldn't have any aspirations if I did, other than "don't die."

I would love to like fantasy, but wow do I have a hard time caring. I played Divinity Original Sin for a couple of hours and never went back. Not one thing intrigued me and it's supposed to be over 100 hours long. UGH. Portal is like 3 hours long and rocked my world. When games are too long, they leave me butthurt, but when they're small and filled with goodness, they leave me begging for more.



Giggity.

I can understand not enjoying the game if you aren't into Fantasy.  I find pleasure in various RPG settings, so it doesn't always have to be fantasy but it certainly can be.  But I love space operas as well, and post apocalyptic worlds and contemporary settings.  I like horror and science fiction as well.

I definitely prefer the larger, longer, more elaborate games though.  If a game is too simple, I might not enjoy it with the exception of early arcade games, Tetris and PC hearts.  lol

Oh, I did like Skyrim even though I never finished it. I played it for over 100 hours per attempt, so I guess it's not all fantasy I dislike? I think it just needs to interest me and although there's a lot of variety in D&D, that also means there's a lot of uninteresting stuff to me. Vampires? Yay! Deities dying/fading from existence based on the amount of belief placed into them? Yay! Generic orcs, elves, hill giants, etc. mehhhh. With the World of Darkness, almost everything is interesting to me. I think a D&D game could be fun for me if the damn thing didn't spend time on critters n' things I found boring, but I've yet to see that.

I managed to finish NWN2 and its DLC years back, but I don't think I would have the patience to sit through it again.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 11:18:23 am
If I ever play it, I'll hafta look into mods.

I do like Bodhi's body (huehuehue~), but I don't think I can get into D&D. The only fantasy stuff I ever really liked was King's Quest and LotR, and the former was just because I was a kid and liked tons of stuff. Had I found it now, I probably wouldn't pay it any heed. Fantasy is so hard for me to relate to because the characters are all so survival-oriented and dedicated to factions that don't exist in our world. I wouldn't want to live in that world and wouldn't have any aspirations if I did, other than "don't die."

I would love to like fantasy, but wow do I have a hard time caring. I played Divinity Original Sin for a couple of hours and never went back. Not one thing intrigued me and it's supposed to be over 100 hours long. UGH. Portal is like 3 hours long and rocked my world. When games are too long, they leave me butthurt, but when they're small and filled with goodness, they leave me begging for more.



Giggity.

I can understand not enjoying the game if you aren't into Fantasy.  I find pleasure in various RPG settings, so it doesn't always have to be fantasy but it certainly can be.  But I love space operas as well, and post apocalyptic worlds and contemporary settings.  I like horror and science fiction as well.

I definitely prefer the larger, longer, more elaborate games though.  If a game is too simple, I might not enjoy it with the exception of early arcade games, Tetris and PC hearts.  lol

Oh, I did like Skyrim even though I never finished it. I played it for over 100 hours per attempt, so I guess it's not all fantasy I dislike? I think it just needs to interest me and although there's a lot of variety in D&D, that also means there's a lot of uninteresting stuff to me. Vampires? Yay! Deities dying/fading from existence based on the amount of belief placed into them? Yay! Generic orcs, elves, hill giants, etc. mehhhh. With the World of Darkness, almost everything is interesting to me. I think a D&D game could be fun for me if the damn thing didn't spend time on critters n' things I found boring, but I've yet to see that.

I managed to finish NWN2 and its DLC years back, but I don't think I would have the patience to sit through it again.

See and I just love the elves and goblins and hill giants and shit like that. They're based on real world myths and even settings that I love bore the hell out of me when they don't mix traditional fantasy elements in with their brilliant unique stuff.  I love The Elder Scrolls because they are a mixture of traditional and unique lore.  So good.  I love D&D because its all very traditional.  I do love Dragon Age very much, but my GOD I am getting so bored with Darkspawn and the limits on magic because of the dangers of the fade and no real dieties.  There is no credible creation myths at all, so we don't know how the world got there like we do with Realmspace or The Elder Scrolls.  There are hardly ANY traditional Goblinkin so far in that setting.  Its mainly Darkspawn, darkspawn, darkspawn.  The only goblinoid race to show up so far are the ghasts.  I was actually really happy to see that, its a shame they haven't introduced any more, like trolls and actual goblins.  That being said, I am still stoked for Dragon Age 4.  lol
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 08, 2019, 11:29:33 am
If I ever play it, I'll hafta look into mods.

I do like Bodhi's body (huehuehue~), but I don't think I can get into D&D. The only fantasy stuff I ever really liked was King's Quest and LotR, and the former was just because I was a kid and liked tons of stuff. Had I found it now, I probably wouldn't pay it any heed. Fantasy is so hard for me to relate to because the characters are all so survival-oriented and dedicated to factions that don't exist in our world. I wouldn't want to live in that world and wouldn't have any aspirations if I did, other than "don't die."

I would love to like fantasy, but wow do I have a hard time caring. I played Divinity Original Sin for a couple of hours and never went back. Not one thing intrigued me and it's supposed to be over 100 hours long. UGH. Portal is like 3 hours long and rocked my world. When games are too long, they leave me butthurt, but when they're small and filled with goodness, they leave me begging for more.



Giggity.

I can understand not enjoying the game if you aren't into Fantasy.  I find pleasure in various RPG settings, so it doesn't always have to be fantasy but it certainly can be.  But I love space operas as well, and post apocalyptic worlds and contemporary settings.  I like horror and science fiction as well.

I definitely prefer the larger, longer, more elaborate games though.  If a game is too simple, I might not enjoy it with the exception of early arcade games, Tetris and PC hearts.  lol

Oh, I did like Skyrim even though I never finished it. I played it for over 100 hours per attempt, so I guess it's not all fantasy I dislike? I think it just needs to interest me and although there's a lot of variety in D&D, that also means there's a lot of uninteresting stuff to me. Vampires? Yay! Deities dying/fading from existence based on the amount of belief placed into them? Yay! Generic orcs, elves, hill giants, etc. mehhhh. With the World of Darkness, almost everything is interesting to me. I think a D&D game could be fun for me if the damn thing didn't spend time on critters n' things I found boring, but I've yet to see that.

I managed to finish NWN2 and its DLC years back, but I don't think I would have the patience to sit through it again.

See and I just love the elves and goblins and hill giants and shit like that. They're based on real world myths and even settings that I love bore the hell out of me when they don't mix traditional fantasy elements in with their brilliant unique stuff.  I love The Elder Scrolls because they are a mixture of traditional and unique lore.  So good.  I love D&D because its all very traditional.  I do love Dragon Age very much, but my GOD I am getting so bored with Darkspawn and the limits on magic because of the dangers of the fade and no real dieties.  There is no credible creation myths at all, so we don't know how the world got there like we do with Realmspace or The Elder Scrolls.  There are hardly ANY traditional Goblinkin so far in that setting.  Its mainly Darkspawn, darkspawn, darkspawn.  The only goblinoid race to show up so far are the ghasts.  I was actually really happy to see that, its a shame they haven't introduced any more, like trolls and actual goblins.  That being said, I am still stoked for Dragon Age 4.  lol

Meh, but I'm like "Oh. Pointed ears. WOW. AMAZING. *eyeroll*" They don't do anything interesting. Oh yeah, the Darkspawn and the Demons in Dragon Age were the only thing that interested me in that setting; especially the Demons. And even then, there weren't enough Demons in the second game for my liking concerning quests and such. "Monster looks weird" just doesn't interest me. I like neat rules and stuff for creatures, like those spriggan tree dudes in Skyrim whom you could steal's briarhearts while in stealth and it instantly killed them. <3

As far as your liking of deities, D&D bores me because there are so many. Each deity doesn't get much time being talked about and it's an arbitrary thing you select at character creation in D&D video games when you pick a deity you follow. That stuff doesn't come up as relevant and the deity never has a strong presence unless there's just one that a cult follows as the main plot or something. Otherwise, you're shit outta luck for the most part. Stuff like that is why I like Warhammer 40K's deities. There are four main chaos gods and they are very heavily "themed" and you can easily cordon off which one supports which shenanigans and how its servants would behave. And people mutate like in Dragon Age (Dragon Age is a massive WH ripoff when it comes to the Demon lore).
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 12:31:17 pm
Meh, but I'm like "Oh. Pointed ears. WOW. AMAZING. *eyeroll*" They don't do anything interesting. Oh yeah, the Darkspawn and the Demons in Dragon Age were the only thing that interested me in that setting; especially the Demons. And even then, there weren't enough Demons in the second game for my liking concerning quests and such. "Monster looks weird" just doesn't interest me. I like neat rules and stuff for creatures, like those spriggan tree dudes in Skyrim whom you could steal's briarhearts while in stealth and it instantly killed them. <3

As far as your liking of deities, D&D bores me because there are so many. Each deity doesn't get much time being talked about and it's an arbitrary thing you select at character creation in D&D video games when you pick a deity you follow. That stuff doesn't come up as relevant and the deity never has a strong presence unless there's just one that a cult follows as the main plot or something. Otherwise, you're shit outta luck for the most part. Stuff like that is why I like Warhammer 40K's deities. There are four main chaos gods and they are very heavily "themed" and you can easily cordon off which one supports which shenanigans and how its servants would behave. And people mutate like in Dragon Age (Dragon Age is a massive WH ripoff when it comes to the Demon lore).

Yeah, I'm a big fan of the deities.  I guess I don't super notice the lack of huge focus on them in the PC games because I have read several of the novels that did.  The Avatar series and many of the Drizzt books have given me quite a lesson on them.  I am a big fan of the goddess Mystra, one of the reasons why I hated the 4.0 ruleset, she got murdered!  :(   lol  Anyway, the books are always on my mind when I play the games.  The Avatar series really is a great primer on many of the different gods.  So when it comes to Realmspace Godlore, I'm good.  I suppose they could do a better job with ingame books like TES does.  Man, when playing TES games I can spend an hour or more just reading some of those ingame books.  They are short but very interesting.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 08, 2019, 12:45:43 pm
Meh, but I'm like "Oh. Pointed ears. WOW. AMAZING. *eyeroll*" They don't do anything interesting. Oh yeah, the Darkspawn and the Demons in Dragon Age were the only thing that interested me in that setting; especially the Demons. And even then, there weren't enough Demons in the second game for my liking concerning quests and such. "Monster looks weird" just doesn't interest me. I like neat rules and stuff for creatures, like those spriggan tree dudes in Skyrim whom you could steal's briarhearts while in stealth and it instantly killed them. <3

As far as your liking of deities, D&D bores me because there are so many. Each deity doesn't get much time being talked about and it's an arbitrary thing you select at character creation in D&D video games when you pick a deity you follow. That stuff doesn't come up as relevant and the deity never has a strong presence unless there's just one that a cult follows as the main plot or something. Otherwise, you're shit outta luck for the most part. Stuff like that is why I like Warhammer 40K's deities. There are four main chaos gods and they are very heavily "themed" and you can easily cordon off which one supports which shenanigans and how its servants would behave. And people mutate like in Dragon Age (Dragon Age is a massive WH ripoff when it comes to the Demon lore).

Yeah, I'm a big fan of the deities.  I guess I don't super notice the lack of huge focus on them in the PC games because I have read several of the novels that did.  The Avatar series and many of the Drizzt books have given me quite a lesson on them.  I am a big fan of the goddess Mystra, one of the reasons why I hated the 4.0 ruleset, she got murdered!  :(   lol  Anyway, the books are always on my mind when I play the games.  The Avatar series really is a great primer on many of the different gods.  So when it comes to Realmspace Godlore, I'm good.  I suppose they could do a better job with ingame books like TES does.  Man, when playing TES games I can spend an hour or more just reading some of those ingame books.  They are short but very interesting.

Maybe someday I'll find another D&D game that fascinates me. For now, though, PlaneScape: Torment is the only one that I can wholeheartedly give a thumbs up to. My only gripe about it now is that it's a bit aged in terms of combat, and (more combat) it uses the AD&D "second edition" rules which I think are a bit weird. THAC0 never really delighted me, and the numeric system of those games is weird. 3.0 onward was like "Yeah...even numbers do shit for attributes. We're still gonna be complex AF for rules, but at least there's some method to our madness, yo.~"

So back on topic, we've got what? Two VtM video games other than Bloodlines 2 coming? One is by the company that made The Council so theories would lend credence probably to some Elysium/dialog sluttery, and the other is by some company that makes a visual novel/Oregon Trail mash-up, so we'll probably get some arcade fight thing with 3 playable clans and some visual novel dialog choices.

I'm automatically interested because VtM, and sure, I'd like to hope they'll be good, but I'm not excited for them. Bloodlines 2, on the other hands, is an immersive sim (i.e. Bloodlines 1, Deus Ex Human Revolution, Dishonored, etc.). Those tickle me when in an interesting world filled with characters and lore I like. <3
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 08, 2019, 01:34:12 pm
So back on topic, we've got what? Two VtM video games other than Bloodlines 2 coming? One is by the company that made The Council so theories would lend credence probably to some Elysium/dialog sluttery, and the other is by some company that makes a visual novel/Oregon Trail mash-up, so we'll probably get some arcade fight thing with 3 playable clans and some visual novel dialog choices.

I'm automatically interested because VtM, and sure, I'd like to hope they'll be good, but I'm not excited for them. Bloodlines 2, on the other hands, is an immersive sim (i.e. Bloodlines 1, Deus Ex Human Revolution, Dishonored, etc.). Those tickle me when in an interesting world filled with characters and lore I like. <3

Oooh The Council looks good.  I have it but have yet to play it.  So now I am more intrigued.  I just hope they're good! 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 11, 2019, 01:03:48 am
I do love Dragon Age very much, but my GOD I am getting so bored with Darkspawn and the limits on magic because of the dangers of the fade and no real dieties.  There is no credible creation myths at all, so we don't know how the world got there like we do with Realmspace or The Elder Scrolls.  There are hardly ANY traditional Goblinkin so far in that setting.

There are "creation myths" in Dragon Age, they're just not "creation truths" like in TES with the Aedra and Daedra.

The beauty of Dragon Age's creation myth is that there very likely isn't one. In the end "The Maker" might just end up being a really old human mage... and that's it...

... or at least that's where I'm putting my theories, seeing the truth about the elven gods in DAI.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 11, 2019, 02:18:21 am
I do love Dragon Age very much, but my GOD I am getting so bored with Darkspawn and the limits on magic because of the dangers of the fade and no real dieties.  There is no credible creation myths at all, so we don't know how the world got there like we do with Realmspace or The Elder Scrolls.  There are hardly ANY traditional Goblinkin so far in that setting.

There are "creation myths" in Dragon Age, they're just not "creation truths" like in TES with the Aedra and Daedra.

The beauty of Dragon Age's creation myth is that there very likely isn't one. In the end "The Maker" might just end up being a really old human mage... and that's it...

... or at least that's where I'm putting my theories, seeing the truth about the elven gods in DAI.

I get that there are creation myths.  You can't play any of the games in the franchise without hearing about the Maker and the Chantry.  But like you said, there are no "creation truths".   So far we have learned that the Old Gods are some kind of mega Dragonkin but we don't know what they are beyond that.  Epically powerful Draconic mages?  We found out what the Elvin gods really are.  Corrupt, selfish, glorified long-lived but mortal Elven Mages.    We know that the Akavir gods are simply fade spirits.  I am dying to know the real story behind the Maker.  If Andraste was really a historic figure and the events she was involved in that ultimately lead to her martyrdom really happened then the Maker is SOMETHING.  Most likely not an actual god because BioWare's MO thusfar regarding Dragon Age religion has been for gods to be unmasked as false.  Yet we do know that spirits are real in this world.  The fade is real.  If spirits are real then how powerful can they get?  In most religions, gods are usually spirits themselves, just very powerful ones, sometimes omnipotent ones as in the case of Judeo/Christianity.  The Judeo/Christian God is a spirit.  An all powerful spirit, but still, a spirit, according to their teachings.  So once the existence of spirits is established, the possibility of the existence of deities ceases to be genuinely outlandish.  And the world that the continent of Thesas exists on didn't come out of thin air. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 11, 2019, 02:33:24 am
I do love Dragon Age very much, but my GOD I am getting so bored with Darkspawn and the limits on magic because of the dangers of the fade and no real dieties.  There is no credible creation myths at all, so we don't know how the world got there like we do with Realmspace or The Elder Scrolls.  There are hardly ANY traditional Goblinkin so far in that setting.

There are "creation myths" in Dragon Age, they're just not "creation truths" like in TES with the Aedra and Daedra.

The beauty of Dragon Age's creation myth is that there very likely isn't one. In the end "The Maker" might just end up being a really old human mage... and that's it...

... or at least that's where I'm putting my theories, seeing the truth about the elven gods in DAI.

I get that there are creation myths.  You can't play any of the games in the franchise without hearing about the Maker and the Chantry.  But like you said, there are no "creation truths".   So far we have learned that the Old Gods are some kind of mega Dragonkin but we don't know what they are beyond that.  Epically powerful Draconic mages?  We found out what the Elvin gods really are.  Corrupt, selfish, glorified long-lived but mortal Elven Mages.    We know that the Akavir gods are simply fade spirits.  I am dying to know the real story behind the Maker.  If Andraste was really a historic figure and the events she was involved in that ultimately lead to her martyrdom really happened then the Maker is SOMETHING.  Most likely not an actual god because BioWare's MO thusfar regarding Dragon Age religion has been for gods to be unmasked as false.  Yet we do know that spirits are real in this world.  The fade is real.  If spirits are real then how powerful can they get?  In most religions, gods are usually spirits themselves, just very powerful ones, sometimes omnipotent ones as in the case of Judeo/Christianity.  The Judeo/Christian God is a spirit.  An all powerful spirit, but still, a spirit, according to their teachings.  So once the existence of spirits is established, the possibility of the existence of deities ceases to be genuinely outlandish.  And the world that the continent of Thesas exists on didn't come out of thin air.

To be fair, though, they just changed a bunch of proper nouns in Warhammer for everything demon/fade/mage-related. I highly urge anyone who liked DA to look up Warhammer daemon/warp/psyker lore. You take Warhammer, superglue it onto a luke-warm Judeo-Christian creation, and you've got DA. Seriously, though...DA has taken so much Warhammer you don't even know, as far as demon/fade/mage stuff goes. They're just name changes for the most part. =/
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 11, 2019, 04:39:39 am
And the world that the continent of Thesas exists on didn't come out of thin air.

Or maybe it's just a regular old planet !

(http://66.media.tumblr.com/705de33cb0deacba7eff8bf0eed48ca1/tumblr_odc9b5TB5W1qgz7buo1_1280.jpg)
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 11, 2019, 04:51:21 am
I do love Dragon Age very much, but my GOD I am getting so bored with Darkspawn and the limits on magic because of the dangers of the fade and no real dieties.  There is no credible creation myths at all, so we don't know how the world got there like we do with Realmspace or The Elder Scrolls.  There are hardly ANY traditional Goblinkin so far in that setting.

There are "creation myths" in Dragon Age, they're just not "creation truths" like in TES with the Aedra and Daedra.

The beauty of Dragon Age's creation myth is that there very likely isn't one. In the end "The Maker" might just end up being a really old human mage... and that's it...

... or at least that's where I'm putting my theories, seeing the truth about the elven gods in DAI.

I get that there are creation myths.  You can't play any of the games in the franchise without hearing about the Maker and the Chantry.  But like you said, there are no "creation truths".   So far we have learned that the Old Gods are some kind of mega Dragonkin but we don't know what they are beyond that.  Epically powerful Draconic mages?  We found out what the Elvin gods really are.  Corrupt, selfish, glorified long-lived but mortal Elven Mages.    We know that the Akavir gods are simply fade spirits.  I am dying to know the real story behind the Maker.  If Andraste was really a historic figure and the events she was involved in that ultimately lead to her martyrdom really happened then the Maker is SOMETHING.  Most likely not an actual god because BioWare's MO thusfar regarding Dragon Age religion has been for gods to be unmasked as false.  Yet we do know that spirits are real in this world.  The fade is real.  If spirits are real then how powerful can they get?  In most religions, gods are usually spirits themselves, just very powerful ones, sometimes omnipotent ones as in the case of Judeo/Christianity.  The Judeo/Christian God is a spirit.  An all powerful spirit, but still, a spirit, according to their teachings.  So once the existence of spirits is established, the possibility of the existence of deities ceases to be genuinely outlandish.  And the world that the continent of Thesas exists on didn't come out of thin air.

To be fair, though, they just changed a bunch of proper nouns in Warhammer for everything demon/fade/mage-related. I highly urge anyone who liked DA to look up Warhammer daemon/warp/psyker lore. You take Warhammer, superglue it onto a luke-warm Judeo-Christian creation, and you've got DA. Seriously, though...DA has taken so much Warhammer you don't even know, as far as demon/fade/mage stuff goes. They're just name changes for the most part. =/

You have mentioned this a few times and I have looked it up.  They do seem fairly similar, though I definitely prefer the concept of mages to psykers. 

Inspired by Warhammer though DA may be, I doubt that we can look to Warhammer for canon answers to the question of who and what The Maker really is, or the Old Gods for that matter.  The Old Gods have only been partially unmasked.  We know that through the proper conditions being met (a true Grey Warden delivering the killing blow) an Old God that has been corrupted into an Archdemon can be killed.  There is clearly something very unique and special about the old gods that they have this power to return from death through the body of a Darkspawn or Blight Touched being.  Does this mean that before they are corrupted, they cannot be killed at all?  I imagine we might find out more about the old gods before we find out more about The Maker.

And the world that the continent of Thesas exists on didn't come out of thin air.

Or maybe it's just a regular old planet !

 That cute little Mass Effect easter egg aside, the Thedas of Dragon Age is not a planet.  Thedas is ON a planet, naturally.  Its not a planet itself.  Its a continent.  As for the planet that Thedas is on, its a planet with magic, the fade and spirits. It was once utterly encompassed by The Fade. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on June 11, 2019, 08:23:22 am
I do love Dragon Age very much, but my GOD I am getting so bored with Darkspawn and the limits on magic because of the dangers of the fade and no real dieties.  There is no credible creation myths at all, so we don't know how the world got there like we do with Realmspace or The Elder Scrolls.  There are hardly ANY traditional Goblinkin so far in that setting.

There are "creation myths" in Dragon Age, they're just not "creation truths" like in TES with the Aedra and Daedra.

The beauty of Dragon Age's creation myth is that there very likely isn't one. In the end "The Maker" might just end up being a really old human mage... and that's it...

... or at least that's where I'm putting my theories, seeing the truth about the elven gods in DAI.

I get that there are creation myths.  You can't play any of the games in the franchise without hearing about the Maker and the Chantry.  But like you said, there are no "creation truths".   So far we have learned that the Old Gods are some kind of mega Dragonkin but we don't know what they are beyond that.  Epically powerful Draconic mages?  We found out what the Elvin gods really are.  Corrupt, selfish, glorified long-lived but mortal Elven Mages.    We know that the Akavir gods are simply fade spirits.  I am dying to know the real story behind the Maker.  If Andraste was really a historic figure and the events she was involved in that ultimately lead to her martyrdom really happened then the Maker is SOMETHING.  Most likely not an actual god because BioWare's MO thusfar regarding Dragon Age religion has been for gods to be unmasked as false.  Yet we do know that spirits are real in this world.  The fade is real.  If spirits are real then how powerful can they get?  In most religions, gods are usually spirits themselves, just very powerful ones, sometimes omnipotent ones as in the case of Judeo/Christianity.  The Judeo/Christian God is a spirit.  An all powerful spirit, but still, a spirit, according to their teachings.  So once the existence of spirits is established, the possibility of the existence of deities ceases to be genuinely outlandish.  And the world that the continent of Thesas exists on didn't come out of thin air.

To be fair, though, they just changed a bunch of proper nouns in Warhammer for everything demon/fade/mage-related. I highly urge anyone who liked DA to look up Warhammer daemon/warp/psyker lore. You take Warhammer, superglue it onto a luke-warm Judeo-Christian creation, and you've got DA. Seriously, though...DA has taken so much Warhammer you don't even know, as far as demon/fade/mage stuff goes. They're just name changes for the most part. =/

You have mentioned this a few times and I have looked it up.  They do seem fairly similar, though I definitely prefer the concept of mages to psykers. 

Inspired by Warhammer though DA may be, I doubt that we can look to Warhammer for canon answers to the question of who and what The Maker really is, or the Old Gods for that matter.  The Old Gods have only been partially unmasked.  We know that through the proper conditions being met (a true Grey Warden delivering the killing blow) an Old God that has been corrupted into an Archdemon can be killed.  There is clearly something very unique and special about the old gods that they have this power to return from death through the body of a Darkspawn or Blight Touched being.  Does this mean that before they are corrupted, they cannot be killed at all?  I imagine we might find out more about the old gods before we find out more about The Maker.

And the world that the continent of Thesas exists on didn't come out of thin air.

Or maybe it's just a regular old planet !

 That cute little Mass Effect easter egg aside, the Thedas of Dragon Age is not a planet.  Thedas is ON a planet, naturally.  Its not a planet itself.  Its a continent.  As for the planet that Thedas is on, its a planet with magic, the fade and spirits. It was one utterly encompassed by The Fade.

Or they're just pulling this stuff outta their butts about the old gods and you'll never get any closure. My DA:I bitterness is showing. D':
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wesp5 on June 11, 2019, 09:31:50 am
People, can you please stick to the topics of a thread and move your Dragon Age / Elder Scrolls discussions to some other place?
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on June 11, 2019, 11:40:01 pm
That cute little Mass Effect easter egg aside, the Thedas of Dragon Age is not a planet.  Thedas is ON a planet, naturally.  Its not a planet itself.  Its a continent.  As for the planet that Thedas is on, its a planet with magic, the fade and spirits. It was once utterly encompassed by The Fade.

I will say that if I am pissed at anything, is if The Maker is real and turns out to be an actual god.

I always thought the worst part in Origins was discovering that the Urn of Sacred Ashes was actually an urn with healing powers. What a bunch of shit. Not even the original legend it was based upon even worked like that.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkZephyr on June 12, 2019, 12:09:00 am
That cute little Mass Effect easter egg aside, the Thedas of Dragon Age is not a planet.  Thedas is ON a planet, naturally.  Its not a planet itself.  Its a continent.  As for the planet that Thedas is on, its a planet with magic, the fade and spirits. It was once utterly encompassed by The Fade.

I will say that if I am pissed at anything, is if The Maker is real and turns out to be an actual god.

I always thought the worst part in Origins was discovering that the Urn of Sacred Ashes was actually an urn with healing powers. What a bunch of shit. Not even the original legend it was based upon even worked like that.

Wesp wants us to stay on topic here, but I will respond to this in the Fantasy Lore thread if you want to continue this discussion:  https://forums.planetvampire.com/off-topic/fantasy-lore/msg148349/#msg148349
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Leorgrium on October 19, 2019, 11:49:53 am
Quote
Vampire: the Masquerade - Coteries of New York will launch December 4th 2019 on PC!
The Nintendo Switch version of the game will be released in Q1 2020.
and we are talking with @PdxInteractive about PS4 and Xbox One versions


https://twitter.com/DrawDistanceDev/status/1185486281704443905
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on October 20, 2019, 02:13:42 am
Quote
Vampire: the Masquerade - Coteries of New York will launch December 4th 2019 on PC!
The Nintendo Switch version of the game will be released in Q1 2020.
and we are talking with @PdxInteractive about PS4 and Xbox One versions


https://twitter.com/DrawDistanceDev/status/1185486281704443905

Holy shit, that's soon!
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wesp5 on October 20, 2019, 10:33:25 am
Any idea what kind of game these really are? No screenshots, no videos with such a close release date?
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on October 20, 2019, 11:46:19 am
Any idea what kind of game these really are? No screenshots, no videos with such a close release date?
I have no idea about Swansong but Coteries of New York looks like a Graphic Novel Adventure
https://www.gog.com/game/vampire_the_masquerade_coteries_of_new_york
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on October 21, 2019, 04:42:57 am
Any idea what kind of game these really are? No screenshots, no videos with such a close release date?
I have no idea about Swansong but Coteries of New York looks like a Graphic Novel Adventure
https://www.gog.com/game/vampire_the_masquerade_coteries_of_new_york

Given the screens/art, that was my take on it as well.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on October 28, 2019, 05:43:09 pm
Given the screens/art, that was my take on it as well.
It is one. ;)


The art is fine but it really depends on the story. Too be honest i don´t expect much.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: mdqp on November 05, 2019, 09:47:38 am
Okay, at least now I know for sure that's all the gameplay it's going to be. I play visual novels and point & click adventures, so it's not like this kills the game for me, but I felt like things were really too vague before. Since they showed just dialogue in the gameplay trailer, I feel it's safe to say it will play like a regular visual novel. It might still be cool, if they play their cards right, although I'll wait for the reviews to come in (and the price to go down), before taking a closer look.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on November 06, 2019, 10:34:57 pm
Okay, at least now I know for sure that's all the gameplay it's going to be. I play visual novels and point & click adventures, so it's not like this kills the game for me, but I felt like things were really too vague before. Since they showed just dialogue in the gameplay trailer, I feel it's safe to say it will play like a regular visual novel. It might still be cool, if they play their cards right, although I'll wait for the reviews to come in (and the price to go down), before taking a closer look.


Hopefully there will be a fair number of meaningful choices and significant branches/impact on the story and/or character interactions based on your starting clan.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: mdqp on November 08, 2019, 10:42:47 am
Hopefully there will be a fair number of meaningful choices and significant branches/impact on the story and/or character interactions based on your starting clan.

I mean, if they don't have that, they might as well not make the game. The only interactions in VNs are choices, after all.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on November 08, 2019, 12:03:24 pm
I mean, if they don't have that, they might as well not make the game. The only interactions in VNs are choices, after all.

I think so as well. You have a game built on choice then you better well deliver some interesting outcomes.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: mdqp on December 11, 2019, 08:15:31 pm
So, the game is out now. Did anyone buy it? If so, would they be willing to share what they think of it?
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on December 12, 2019, 06:21:49 am
So, the game is out now. Did anyone buy it? If so, would they be willing to share what they think of it?

Ditto. Share as thou may with all of us !
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: mdqp on December 13, 2019, 10:04:10 am
Reviews don't seem too encouraging. Sounds like the game often doesn't acknowledge your character sex (the characters are only pre-made, btw, 3 clans, 2 males, 1 female), clan (going as far as to allow you to use disciplines you shouldn't have access to) or even choices (seems like there is only one ending, and the game has a tendency to railroad you).

Not even the moment to moment text seems to be particularly reactive to your actions, with players reporting being berated for being uncooperative, even when they did everything they were asked to do. The game also clocks at a very low amount of hours (I have seen claims between 4-8 hours, but most seem to say it's between 4-6).

It seems like the atmosphere is well-done, at least, but I'll be skipping this one. Some are even excusing that the game is fairly linear, when visual novels are all about choices and branching paths, so it sounds like the positive reviews are being overly generous, IMO.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on December 25, 2019, 08:31:18 pm
So, the game is out now. Did anyone buy it? If so, would they be willing to share what they think of it?

Ditto. Share as thou may with all of us !

I bought it but haven't played it yet. I was all "VtM?! Shut up and take my money!"
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: mdqp on January 05, 2020, 10:27:35 am
I bought it but haven't played it yet. I was all "VtM?! Shut up and take my money!"

Ha-ha-ha-ha! That's certainly a thought crossing my mind often, recently. Hard not to be excited when a new bloodlines game is arriving. Did you get to try the this one, eventually?
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: fylimar on January 08, 2020, 08:58:20 am
Currently I'm not that invested. The playable clans (Brujah, Torri and Ventrue) are not to my taste and then you have pre-made characters. For me, that is only acceptable in a game, if the character is called Geralt of Rivia or Sherlock Holmes. Well, generally pre-made characters are ok in adventures, but not in a role playing game. I like to be able to build my character. I probably will play the game at some point, but it's not a priority.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on January 08, 2020, 02:40:27 pm
Currently I'm not that invested. The playable clans (Brujah, Torri and Ventrue) are not to my taste and then you have pre-made characters. For me, that is only acceptable in a game, if the character is called Geralt of Rivia or Sherlock Holmes. Well, generally pre-made characters are ok in adventures, but not in a role playing game. I like to be able to build my character. I probably will play the game at some point, but it's not a priority.

I don't know. I think there are several ways to make an RPG and one of them is by offering players a "pre-made character" (relatively speaking because you can customize the living hell of it). I mean, The Witcher is one of the best CRPG franchises ever made. The Witcher 3 is nothing short of a masterpiece.

Now I fully understand the issue of preference and taste, to which everyone is entitled to. However, it's important to keep an open mind about the obvious advantages of having "pre-made characters" in CRPG's: you have a voiced character that feels closer to a living individual, you can offer more dialogue options that will sound organic, characters can react with specificity towards you (Like Yennefer, Triss or Dandelion do when interacting with Geralt).
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: fylimar on January 08, 2020, 04:49:19 pm
Well, I think, they did it well with Hawke in Dragon Age 2. Kind of pre-made, but customizable.
I don't say, that rpgs with pre-made characters are bad, but I prefer to make my own character.
My main issue with the are the playable clans though. Not really my cup of tea.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Nanaloma on January 09, 2020, 06:31:38 am
Currently I'm not that invested. The playable clans (Brujah, Torri and Ventrue) are not to my taste and then you have pre-made characters. For me, that is only acceptable in a game, if the character is called Geralt of Rivia or Sherlock Holmes. Well, generally pre-made characters are ok in adventures, but not in a role playing game. I like to be able to build my character. I probably will play the game at some point, but it's not a priority.

Most of the role playing games I've played such as Gothic/Risen, Two Worlds, Vampyr, etc have pre-made characters.  I wish that weren't so but the game business is cut-throat and in a lot of ways, similar to Hollywood movies where a budget film is lauded and sequels made because it made a nice profit and excellent movies are dust-binned because sales couldn't justify their huge budget. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: fylimar on January 09, 2020, 05:42:06 pm
Currently I'm not that invested. The playable clans (Brujah, Torri and Ventrue) are not to my taste and then you have pre-made characters. For me, that is only acceptable in a game, if the character is called Geralt of Rivia or Sherlock Holmes. Well, generally pre-made characters are ok in adventures, but not in a role playing game. I like to be able to build my character. I probably will play the game at some point, but it's not a priority.

Most of the role playing games I've played such as Gothic/Risen, Two Worlds, Vampyr, etc have pre-made characters.  I wish that weren't so but the game business is cut-throat and in a lot of ways, similar to Hollywood movies where a budget film is lauded and sequels made because it made a nice profit and excellent movies are dust-binned because sales couldn't justify their huge budget.

Luckily there are enough games out there, where I can make a protagonist. But you are right, all the sequels and prequels are quite telling. I just read, that they plan to make a reboot of one of my favorite shows, Firefly. Not something, I'm keen on.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on January 09, 2020, 06:01:44 pm
I just read, that they plan to make a reboot of one of my favorite shows, Firefly. Not something, I'm keen on.

Oh lord... do you still have the link ? I don't find these to be good news either.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: fylimar on January 09, 2020, 07:44:29 pm
I just read, that they plan to make a reboot of one of my favorite shows, Firefly. Not something, I'm keen on.

Oh lord... do you still have the link ? I don't find these to be good news either.

It was posted in a Babylon 5 group on Facebook, but I think, I found the article (finding somethin gagain at Facebook is kind of pointless)

https://comicbook.com/2017/02/09/fox-will-move-forward-with-firefly-reboot-on-one-condition/

They are talking about either a reboot or a new show in the Firefly universe. I would love the latter, but despise the former.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on January 10, 2020, 01:53:49 pm
Hasn't really been that long since the last show. I mean, we're getting another TNG show for fuck's sake.

It mostly depends on the entire crew deciding to take a shot on it, which might be difficult since a lot of them have moved to other stuff. Maybe a spinoff would be better.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Leorgrium on April 09, 2020, 04:07:30 pm
VTM - Shadows of New York – is a stand-alone expansion to Coteries of New York. It will present a personal and unique vtm tale... so welcome again to New York City and welcome to the Lasombra clan. :)

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1279630/Vampire_The_Masquerade__Shadows_of_New_York/ (https://store.steampowered.com/app/1279630/Vampire_The_Masquerade__Shadows_of_New_York/)
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on April 09, 2020, 06:33:41 pm
VTM - Shadows of New York – is a stand-alone expansion to Coteries of New York. It will present a personal and unique vtm tale... so welcome again to New York City and welcome to the Lasombra clan. :)

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1279630/Vampire_The_Masquerade__Shadows_of_New_York/ (https://store.steampowered.com/app/1279630/Vampire_The_Masquerade__Shadows_of_New_York/)
Cool i guess?!? Sorry i haven´t played Coteries but i hope with this expansion opens the door for playable Lasombra in a Bloodlines 2 dlc.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wicih on April 15, 2020, 09:04:52 pm
Well, I think one thing I didn't like in Coteries was that main quest events where too often. Really, the longer You play, the deeper you are into local kindred family's secrets and dirty things and then... PUFF!

You just finished game, though You have that much to do for local chantry for example. Anyway I heard that Shadows shall be longer, so hopefully they will give us more time for side quests  :azn:

Rest of Coteries is masterpiece to me, dialogues and illustrations, atmosphere and soundtrack it all is great
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: edx on April 30, 2020, 05:32:13 pm
Over Twitter, Worlds of Darkness announced  (https://twitter.com/worldofdarkness/status/1255879154702180352)three upcoming interactive horror novels from Choice of Games:
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on April 30, 2020, 05:56:05 pm
Over Twitter, Worlds of Darkness announced  (https://twitter.com/worldofdarkness/status/1255879154702180352)three upcoming interactive horror novels from Choice of Games:
Too many Vampire games! Lets hope that Paradox don´t ruin the IP like Activision with Guitar Hero if they release every quarter a new game.I believe that Bloodlines 2 will be a good game but all the others seems to be average at best.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on April 30, 2020, 08:38:37 pm
Over Twitter, Worlds of Darkness announced  (https://twitter.com/worldofdarkness/status/1255879154702180352)three upcoming interactive horror novels from Choice of Games:
Too many Vampire games! Lets hope that Paradox don´t ruin the IP like Activision with Guitar Hero if they release every quarter a new game.I believe that Bloodlines 2 will be a good game but all the others seems to be average at best.



This is a concern of mine as well. This might cause VtM visual novel market oversaturization, and by proxy, VtM oversaturization itself. =/
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on April 30, 2020, 08:57:24 pm
I kind of agree... a little. I'd like to know a bit more about an actual game like Werewolf: The Apocalypse.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on April 30, 2020, 09:11:00 pm
I kind of agree... a little. I'd like to know a bit more about an actual game like Werewolf: The Apocalypse.



Ditto, though the development hell Werewolf game being made doesn't look all that good in my opinion. You're a named character in some deforestation/pollution storyline or something, I think. Meh. I'd much prefer to play as a Glasswalker or Bone Gnawer Werewolf. Those two types of Garou live in cities, with the former being like Ventrue, and the latter being like Brujah a bit. Just running through the woods killing loggers sounds lame and a bit evil, if that's what they have in mind for us. Kindred should NOT be more moral than Garou in general. Garou are arguably the most "good" supernaturals you can play as in the World of Darkness.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on April 30, 2020, 09:50:59 pm
I... don't think you're fighting "loggers in the woods" but a multi-national company called Pentex, which is apparently run by kindred under the influence of The Wyrm.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on May 01, 2020, 04:05:52 am
I... don't think you're fighting "loggers in the woods" but a multi-national company called Pentex, which is apparently run by kindred under the influence of The Wyrm.



There are "a few Kindred in upper management positions" per the White Wolf Wiki. It's largely not Kindred-based, though, to my understanding. I suppose the modern day living-in-a-tribe-out-in-the-woods thing just doesn't appeal to me in the slightest. I've listened to hundreds and hundreds of hours of VtM tabletop games. However, I couldn't get through a dozen hours of Werewolf: the Apocalypse. It bored me.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on May 01, 2020, 03:00:23 pm
This is a concern of mine as well. This might cause VtM visual novel market oversaturization, and by proxy, VtM oversaturization itself. =/
Thank god that they aren´t using the Bloodlines brand for these game because let´s face it all those games who aren´t Bloodlines 2 appear to be average games at best.
Currently there are 7 new Vampire since 2019 in the planning. Only one game was released and that was Coteries and had average reviews. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_of_Darkness_video_games (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_of_Darkness_video_games)
I'd like to know a bit more about an actual game like Werewolf: The Apocalypse.
Maybe this will be a good game at the end but I highly doubt that. First the developer isn´t known for great games and second Earthblood we don´t know much for 2020 game.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on May 01, 2020, 06:17:12 pm
What would I do without your optimism to keep me alive through this quarantine Wilhelm? I've no idea :rofl:
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on May 02, 2020, 11:53:52 pm
What would I do without your optimism to keep me alive through this quarantine Wilhelm? I've no idea :rofl:
So why should i be optimistic when they didn´t make good games? Of course you can´t rule out that even the worst studio make a great gamebut that highly unlikely. Sorry Cyanide´s trackrecord isn´t that good. They are average at best. So why should this suddenly chance with Earthblood?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyanide_(company) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyanide_(company))
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on May 03, 2020, 03:26:04 am
It definitely shouldn't but I like where their focus is on. They are not making the next big competitor to Dragon Age, they're just making a cool werewolf game to establish the franchise and put a hard foot on werewolf games, which to me is a good idea since the best werewolf thing we have is... Skyrim... and that's not really a werewolf game at all.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wesp5 on May 03, 2020, 07:42:38 am
Sorry Cyanide´s trackrecord isn´t that good.
I heard that the Styx games were fine, and those are most similar to the game they are now making. Looking at trackrecords wouldn't be good for Bloodlines 2 either, as Hardsuit Labs only made one multiplayer shooter before that I know of...
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on May 03, 2020, 09:17:39 am
Sorry Cyanide´s trackrecord isn´t that good.
I heard that the Styx games were fine, and those are most similar to the game they are now making. Looking at trackrecords wouldn't be good for Bloodlines 2 either, as Hardsuit Labs only made one multiplayer shooter before that I know of...



Styx? Eww, so they made that clunky Of Orcs and Men game, too, if that's the case (since Styx originates from it). I played that game, felt dirty for even owning it, and stopped playing very shortly into it. I think that having one "meh" game under a company's belt isn't as much of an indicator of what you can expect from a developer as having a whole slew of "meh" games under their belt. I don't know if the multiplayer game you're talking about is good or not, but one failure doesn't show a pattern. Multiple failures certainly can, however.


I'm not convinced that Bloodlines 2 will be excellent, but - while Outstar does have biased reasons to support the game - she's still recently-enough an independent person (as opposed to being part of White Wolf at the time) to be fairly easy to read. She looks legitimately excited after playing the Alpha for 30+ hours. That's not to say it's perfect or even wonderful, but I think she would have been more reserved and said less than she said about Bloodlines 2 so as to hide her disgust with the game if it was a huge disappointment at the time.


Of course, this is all dependent upon the viewer's/reader's take on Outstar's authenticity. If you think she's a snake in the grass, then this take is irrelevant.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wesp5 on May 03, 2020, 10:03:17 am
I don't know if the multiplayer game you're talking about is good or not, but one failure doesn't show a pattern.
As I was made aware of Bloodlines 2 ahead of the time :), I managed to try out Blacklight Retribution before it was closed down. While I'm not into multiplayer and can't say much about the game itself, the mapping was quite solid and atmospheric!

Quote
She looks legitimately excited after playing the Alpha for 30+ hours.
The problem with Outstar is that she is pretty much exited about everthing connected to the WoD ;). But what I have seen of Bloodlines 2 yet does look promising to say the least!
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on May 03, 2020, 10:19:47 am
Quote
She looks legitimately excited after playing the Alpha for 30+ hours.
The problem with Outstar is that she is pretty much exited about everthing connected to the WoD ;). But what I have seen of Bloodlines 2 yet does look promising to say the least!



Oh, you make a good point there. I believe in her authenticity, but - and I'll need to go back and check - I think she may have been pretty hard on that Vampire/Mage PC game that came out a few years ago that's sort of like a visual novel. But in general, yes, she's pretty psyched about virtually everything that's WoD, so that's good to keep in mind.


Yes, Bloodlines 2 does look very promising. My only concerns are whether or not the lady writing under Brian Mitsoda can keep her personal IRL politics out of the game...and the other thing that concerns me is that weird third person flip kick thing. It looks like it yanks you right out of your view and any control you have over your character, and I wasn't getting the impression that you are telling the game when to do that move.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on May 03, 2020, 01:50:19 pm
So what you're saying is that you'd like this game to be a "safe space" for you :rofl: ?

Politics are everywhere. They are an integral and inescapable part of our lives. If Cara Ellison wants to talk about the fiasco of the Trump presidency or the madness of right wing politics then that only makes the game better if she takes the time to make good points within the story. I'd rather have brave writers saying shit I don't like than people cowering at the sight of "market loss" generated by people who are unwilling to engage others in politics.

I still want vampires sucking blood and betraying each other but we should deffinitely embrace these issues rather than supress them.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on May 03, 2020, 02:31:36 pm
Looking at trackrecords wouldn't be good for Bloodlines 2 either, as Hardsuit Labs only made one multiplayer shooter before that I know of...
Blacklight: Retribution is more a Zombie Studios Game than a game from Hardsuit Labs. Maybe it's unfair to compare Hardsuit Labs with Zombie but to be honest they appear to be the remains of Zombie Studios. And their track record isn´t great either.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zombie_Studios (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zombie_Studios)
Their most well known series Spec Ops was average and pretty forgettable (the jewel Spec Ops the Line was made from Yaeger. Zombie wasn´t in any form involved). Maybe Blacklight: Retribution was their best game but I haven´t played it neither did it really leave an impression. It was just another military 1st person shooter.
But I remember that they made the first game which had used Unreal Engine 4 engine. Clearly a slenderman type of game but it was ok. Nothing special just ok.

The only reason why I want to believe in Bloodlines 2, well it's Brian Mitsoda. Without him and to some extent Chris Avellone plus Rik Schaffer & Margaret Tangit it would be totally different but I am really looking forward for Bloodlines 2 overall story and its characters. Of course all the other parts of Bloodlines 2 like its core gameplay could suck but it doesn´t change the fact that it's a Brian Mitsoda game.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on May 03, 2020, 02:37:35 pm
They are also making an effort to have the game be as close to BL1 as possible in regards to the interface and mechanics, which is something I wouldn't have been in favor of but... I can understand why they feel the need to do that. I can already see the "fan backslash" against the game.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on May 03, 2020, 02:43:27 pm
So what you're saying is that you'd like this game to be a "safe space" for you :rofl: ?

Politics are everywhere. They are an integral and inescapable part of our lives. If Cara Ellison wants to talk about the fiasco of the Trump presidency or the madness of right wing politics then that only makes the game better if she takes the time to make good points within the story. I'd rather have brave writers saying shit I don't like than people cowering at the sight of "market loss" generated by people who are unwilling to engage others in politics.
Of course many rightwingers / Trump fans (I don´t care, I am european) will get triggered and make tons of Youtube videos because how dare they make fun of their beloved leader and that Bloodlines 2 is too political compare to first Bloodlines. I am sorry did they ever play Bloodlines 1? I don´t think so. There are many Anti Bush / republicans lines and I am totally cool with that along some democrates and EU jokes. I don´t think that Hardsuit Labs uses Trump directly but maybe someone like US President Robert Thorne.
They are also making an effort to have the be as close to BL1 as possible in regards to the interface and mechanics, which is something I wouldn't have been in favor of but... I can understand why they feel the need to do that. I can already see the "fan backslash" against the game.
The game is called Bloodlines 2, in a sequel you can´t change that much from beloved cult classic.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wesp5 on May 03, 2020, 03:25:35 pm
I don´t think that Hardsuit Labs uses Trump directly but maybe someone like US President Robert Thorne.
I don't believe people fear that kind of politics, but rather the usual SJW stuff that is ruining games nowadays. Like Cara Ellison mentioned adding trigger warnings to quests for people insecure enough who still want to play a blood drinking monster! This doesn't make much sense. Or just look at The Outer Worlds! Basically all male characters are stupid losers and all female characters are strong women who rule the game world.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on May 03, 2020, 03:32:48 pm
@Wilhelm-Streicher: I say that because BL2 could've had a dialogue wheel or even voiced dialogue (all things which I would've been perfectly fine with) but they're not doing that though so they clearly want to take a more conservative route. The only thing I thought was a bit controversial that they removed was third person but so far everything seems to be fundamentally the same as BL1. We'll have to see if the story, the athmosphere and the gameplay serve the game as a good RPG... in my humble opinion.

@Wesp5: "Stupid SJW stuff" is also code for "Feminism and LGTBQ+ representation", which to me is a rather insensitive (to say the least) position to take when engaging in politics.

As for the trigger warnings, I'd agree it's perhaps hurtful to place them before every quest but it's not necessarily a bad idea to add a disclaimer before the game begins. After all, no one is ever going to get killed by a blood drinking monster, but people have been actually raped so it's not entirely wrong to warn victims in some way that they might find hurtful content in the game. I'd concede that it shouldn't be mentioned before each quest though.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on May 03, 2020, 04:18:00 pm
@Wilhelm-Streicher: I say that because BL2 could've had a dialogue wheel or even voiced dialogue (all things which I would've been perfectly fine with) but they're not doing that though so they clearly want to take a more conservative route. The only thing I thought was a bit controversial that they removed was third person but so far everything seems to be fundamentally the same as BL1. We'll have to see if the story, the athmosphere and the gameplay serve the game as a good RPG... in my humble opinion.

@Wesp5: "Stupid SJW stuff" is also code for "Feminism and LGTBQ+ representation", which to me is a rather insensitive (to say the least) position to take when engaging in politics.

As for the trigger warnings, I'd agree it's perhaps hurtful to place them before every quest but it's not necessarily a bad idea to add a disclaimer before the game begins. After all, no one is ever going to get killed by a blood drinking monster, but people have been actually raped so it's not entirely wrong to warn victims in some way that they might find hurtful content in the game. I'd concede that it shouldn't be mentioned before each quest though.



Highwayman, Wesp said "usual SJW stuff." YOU said he said "stupid SJW stuff." This gives the impression that you're deliberately misquoting him to build a strawman against him, or that you had a Freudian slip and believe "SJW stuff" is actually stupid. I don't disagree with that last sentiment...


"Trigger warnings" are what ratings should be for. Graphic violence, sexual violence, and drug use, profanity, should cover most everything relevant. It's the World of Darkness. It is a terrible place. If someone can't handle it, there are tons of games these soft folks can play instead.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on May 03, 2020, 04:25:02 pm
I don't believe people fear that kind of politics, but rather the usual SJW stuff that is ruining games nowadays. Like Cara Ellison mentioned adding trigger warnings to quests for people insecure enough who still want to play a blood drinking monster! This doesn't make much sense. Or just look at The Outer Worlds! Basically all male characters are stupid losers and all female characters are strong women who rule the game world.
I don´t mind better representations for minority groups but I hate the stuff when they are too forced & don´t have a purpose and games don´t have good representations for hetero men. The best case is that there should be strong male and female characters besides some dumb male and female ones.
Characters regardless the gender, race age or sexuality should be first interesting and not like we need more of XYZ because of our own agenda.
And to the politics, I still think that world rightwingers and to some extent leftwingers are too sensitive about this stuff. Especially in the US, which is possibly Bloodlines 2 biggest selling market, many people are quickly offended by some Trump jokes.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on May 03, 2020, 04:56:54 pm
I don't believe people fear that kind of politics, but rather the usual SJW stuff that is ruining games nowadays. Like Cara Ellison mentioned adding trigger warnings to quests for people insecure enough who still want to play a blood drinking monster! This doesn't make much sense. Or just look at The Outer Worlds! Basically all male characters are stupid losers and all female characters are strong women who rule the game world.
I don´t mind better representations for minority groups but I hate the stuff when they are too forced & don´t have a purpose and games don´t have good representations for hetero men. The best case is that there should the strong male and female characters besides some dumb male and female ones.
Characters regardless of gender, race age or sexuality should be first interesting and not like we need more of XYZ because of our own agenda.
And to the  politics, I still think that world rightwingers and to some extent leftwingers are too sensitive about this stuff. Especially in the US, which is possibly Bloodlines 2 biggest selling market, many people are quickly offended by some Trump jokes.



I agree with your representation ideology. Gay/lesbian/trans/etc. characters are typically either A) forced trash seems to have started as "this character will be gay/lesbian/trans/etc.! That's my foundation for the character! Ummm...now what window dressing should I apply to this shallow character to make my quest to add <insert_X_group> characters to more games just to have more of them?!" or B) take a preexisting white/straight/male/female character and make the character suddenly gay, or a female version, or change the ethnicity of the character, etc., because "Well shit. We're too lazy to write good characters. Let's just turn the well-written characters gender/ethnicity/sexuality-flipped versions of themselves so that we don't have to re-write them, and then try to focus on that aspect of the character more than the things that made people love the character in the first place!"


I say make characters. If the character you made feels like he or she would be interesting or enriched as a homosexual/trans/black or whatever, then go for it. Those things should be the *least* focused-on aspect of the characters; not the most.


As for Trump jokes, my concern isn't the jokes themselves so much as how they date the game in a bad way. The Bush Administration jokes in Bloodlines 1 were pretty dull stuff. I wasn't even political back then and don't know what he did. The jokes were some of the least funny attempts at comedy in the game, and - perhaps more importantly - political jokes like "blah blah blah, political group I don't like" are the laziest form of writing and not the sort of thing allegedly talented writers should be getting paid to do. If they want to post such lame gags on their Twitter accounts or whatever the kids these days post on, so be it, but I want quality writing.


Besides, I don't want "AAA" games (or even whatever Bloodlines 2 is, if it isn't one) to be political agenda-based. I played a dumb game on Steam called "Feminazi Simulator." It cost like a dollar or two, and it doesn't impede anyone who disagrees with its politics from enjoying a great game, because the game itself isn't great, while the political messaging is still present. Deliberately making a divisive game based purely on real-world politics won't get more Bloodlines games made as it could hurt sales, and everyone still has SNL to get their lazy political jokes.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Wilhelm-Streicher on May 03, 2020, 05:24:09 pm
As for Trump jokes, my concern isn't the jokes themselves so much as how they date the game in a bad way. The Bush Administration jokes in Bloodlines 1 were pretty dull stuff. I wasn't even political back then and don't know what he did. The jokes were some of the least funny attempts at comedy in the game, and - perhaps more importantly - political jokes like "blah blah blah, political group I don't like" are the laziest form of writing and not the sort of thing allegedly talented writers should be getting paid to do. If they want to post such lame gags on their Twitter accounts or whatever the kids these days post on, so be it, but I want quality writing.
I occasionally smile when I play Bloodlines 1 and see these jokes. I still find those jokes amusing. Also Bloodlines 1 takes place in 2004 so of course it's a product of this time. So lets have fun and embrace those. If you don´t want to offend people, well its almost impossible nowadays to make a game.
Also like I said I could less care as european if some stupid rightwinger get offended by something even if they are lame Trump jokes. The main problem in our (world) society is that we can´t longer laugh at ourselves but it's still ok to laugh at other states. Almost the whole world laughs when Trump says something stupid but Americans aren´t allowed to join the laugher? But its okay to laugh about other world leaders like Boris Johnson? Give me a break.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Highwayman667 on May 03, 2020, 06:06:23 pm
Highwayman, Wesp said "usual SJW stuff." YOU said he said "stupid SJW stuff." This gives the impression that you're deliberately misquoting him to build a strawman against him, or that you had a Freudian slip and believe "SJW stuff" is actually stupid. I don't disagree with that last sentiment...

"Trigger warnings" are what ratings should be for. Graphic violence, sexual violence, and drug use, profanity, should cover most everything relevant. It's the World of Darkness. It is a terrible place. If someone can't handle it, there are tons of games these soft folks can play instead.

Nobody is "soft folk" for having feelings, emotions and being sensitive to different issues. Everyone has the right to be properly warned about an experience that may be harmful to them in some way, shape or form. Nobody is a lesser person for that.

The reason why we're discussing this or why Cara Ellison probably brings this up is because the ratings system is ineffective at handling this, and with good reason since it's not even supposed to do that. The function of the ratings system is to prevent children from playing games that are not within their age range; it has no way whatsoever to prevent victims of sexual abuse to be exposed to content they might be sensitive to.

As for the "stupid SJW stuff", I didn't mean to misquote him and I can perfectly apologize... to him. My point remains the same, a lot of people that complain about "SJW stuff" are simply sounding off their own bigoted dog whistles: what is the problem of having trans, queer or LGBTI characters in a game ? Maybe none to you DarkProphet, but I think it's reasonable to assume that people who "don't want to see that type of content in a game" are usually bigots.

My only issue with "SJW stuff" is if it's represented poorly. Recently I finished watching Star Trek: Picard and I was dissapointed at their jabs at the Trump administration: they were poorly done, uncreative and they trivialized deeply problematic issues. They failed at conveying a message and so would be "my fear" with Brian and Cara when it comes to BL2.

Characters regardless the gender, race age or sexuality should be first interesting and not like we need more of XYZ because of our own agenda.

To clarify, I don't believe anyone (except perhaps the companies) are trying to fulfill any agenda of sorts.

I am from Venezuela and I've seen movies with my family since I've been five years old. Every time we saw someone from Venezuela, an actor or a character, it was usually a terrorist or drug dealer. This was something that bothered us a bit because it was obviously not representative of our culture. We are not terrorists or drug dealers and yet pop culture would've made you think otherwise during the 90's.

So I understand writers and developers when they say "Hey, what if we turned this cool and awesome character, who is white, into a black or hispanic person ? Maybe that would be an opportunity to represent people in a better light".

That's not really trying to serve an agenda, it's just being... nice and decent.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: DarkProphet on May 03, 2020, 09:26:19 pm
Nobody is "soft folk" for having feelings, emotions and being sensitive to different issues. Everyone has the right to be properly warned about an experience that may be harmful to them in some way, shape or form. Nobody is a lesser person for that.



I never said they're "lesser people." In fact, I believe they are greater people, in indeed their sensitivity to such issues comes purely from a place of innocence and/or an abhorrence of malice/wrongdoing, etc. My enjoyment of darker things is something I should not be proud of, and has left me desensitized in some ways I might be better off it I was not.



Quote
The reason why we're discussing this or why Cara Ellison probably brings this up is because the ratings system is ineffective at handling this, and with good reason since it's not even supposed to do that. The function of the ratings system is to prevent children from playing games that are not within their age range; it has no way whatsoever to prevent victims of sexual abuse to be exposed to content they might be sensitive to.



But to "properly" give all trigger warnings and at the appropriate times so as to allow someone to play the game without doing a quest that might trigger him or her, you'd need to basically spoil the gist of every quest. For instance, "TRIGGER WARNING: contains cannibalism, rape, verbal abuse, petty larcency, profanity, murder, manslaughter," and so on, on any given quest (perhaps I'm misreading what you were wanting) would simply spoil the quest. If they were going to do this, they would need to have it be something you can turn off...maybe kinda like the Half-Life 2 and Deus Ex: Human Revolution developer diary speech bubbles you can touch and interact with optionally in those games.


Quote
As for the "stupid SJW stuff", I didn't mean to misquote him and I can perfectly apologize... to him.

I'm not asking you to apologize to me, nor should there be any impression that I want you to since I already said I agree with the "stupid SJW stuff" statement.

Quote
My point remains the same, a lot of people that complain about "SJW stuff" are simply sounding off their own bigoted dog whistles: what is the problem of having trans, queer or LGBTI characters in a game ? Maybe none to you DarkProphet, but I think it's reasonable to assume that people who "don't want to see that type of content in a game" are usually bigots.


That's quite a generalization to say that they're "usually bigots." Some people simply take umbrage with the agenda-driven normalization/"representation" of homosexuality and transsexuality. The issue isn't "How DAAARE that game have one gay character?!?!" The issue is...let's look at Borderlands: The Presequel. It's the one on the moon. While my friend and I are playing, she - who is a lesbian - proceeds to say "man, there's a lot of fuckin' lesbians on this moon." I cracked up due to the irony of a lesbian practically griping about the sheer volume of lesbians in a game, then thought on it a bit more and realized an issue: overrepresentation.

The percentage of people who ascribe to homosexuality, transsexuality, and various other groups are a tiny fraction of the population. Having one gay or lesbian character in a game with say...20 characters already overinflates the representation of homosexuality in the world. If you have 50 characters in a game, and one is a trans male, one is a trans female, one is gay, one is lesbian, and one is "queer," well now 10% of the population is made up of an anomaly in humanity ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_sexual_orientation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_sexual_orientation) ). This number is overrepresentation. Trans people are of a smaller population than LGB folks. One could claim that people are shy about proclaiming a different sexuality or gender for fear of repercussions, but that's purely speculation, and the media praises such folks. After all, Caitlyn Jenner is the most heroic human heroine that ever heroed, supposedly, and anyone who would say or do anything against the LGBTQ+ community will be socially lambasted and "cancelled." You could legit risk your life and save ten children you've never met before from drowning, but Caitlyn Jenner would be declared more of a hero.

So what we have is people misrepresenting human sexuality to serve some peculiar agenda to cram as many characters of a certain sexuality as they can "get away with" into certain games, movies, etc. Rather than ascribe some intentionally bad motive on their part, I'll pretend that they're trying to make people find homosexuality and the like to be more normal and like they shouldn't feel uncomfortable around folks of a different sexuality or whatever, and I think that's a nice sentiment. However, noticeably overpopulating/forcing a setting to be full of a statistical anomaly of people without in-universe explanation comes off as flagrant manipulation of the audience and an insult of its intelligence by being such obvious propaganda in the place of entertainment.

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My only issue with "SJW stuff" is if it's represented poorly. Recently I finished watching Star Trek: Picard and I was dissapointed at their jabs at the Trump administration: they were poorly done, uncreative and they trivialized deeply problematic issues. They failed at conveying a message and so would be "my fear" with Brian and Cara when it comes to BL2.


Oh man, I watched Critical Drinker's and Redlettermedia's reviews on that show, and it was hilaaaarious. "Sheer. Fucking. Hubris.~" I didn't watch the show, but I've seen enough clips and heard enough about it to know that it was lazy propaganda, and disrespectful to Star Trek. Star Trek usually presented some societal issue but didn't slap you across the face with what you should or shouldn't do. It was more the presentation of the pros and cons of each side of an argument, and even if one side was chosen, they would often regret part of the decision or wonder if the other way would have been better. Not always, but it was a philosophical thing, and a fun exercise in thought of real-world topics being presented in a sci-fi setting. Apparently they just straight up shat the bed with Picard and shove your face in the writer's opinions.
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To clarify, I don't believe anyone (except perhaps the companies) are trying to fulfill any agenda of sorts.

I am from Venezuela and I've seen movies with my family since I've been five years old. Every time we saw someone from Venezuela, an actor or a character, it was usually a terrorist or drug dealer. This was something that bothered us a bit because it was obviously not representative of our culture. We are not terrorists or drug dealers and yet pop culture would've made you think otherwise during the 90's.




So the entertainment industry is falsely representing your nation and you don't like it. I'm glad we're on the same page, then. That means you should be totally fine with reducing the number of African American scientists shown in TV shows and movies since it misrepresents the United States to the public:
 https://www.nsf.gov/statistics/2017/nsf17310/digest/occupation/overall.cfm (https://www.nsf.gov/statistics/2017/nsf17310/digest/occupation/overall.cfm) and https://www.nsf.gov/statistics/2017/nsf17310/digest/occupation/blacks.cfm (https://www.nsf.gov/statistics/2017/nsf17310/digest/occupation/blacks.cfm)


I'm being facetious to some extent, though. It's a lie, just as the Venezuela stuff you don't like is a lie, and just as the overpopulation in certain pieces of fiction of LGBTQ+ characters is a lie.


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So I understand writers and developers when they say "Hey, what if we turned this cool and awesome character, who is white, into a black or hispanic person ? Maybe that would be an opportunity to represent people in a better light".

That's not really trying to serve an agenda, it's just being... nice and decent.





Yeah, just like if I went in and changed a bunch of non-white characters to be white because I want to be "nice and decent."  :rofl: 


That's the writers effectively saying "Uh-oh...we don't know how to represent non-whites in a positive light, so lets just turn the white characters people love into non-white characters. God forbid we can write a non-white character well." It's clear to me that skin color is the most important thing to people who think like this. Skin color should not be a quota, and "converting" someone from one skin color to another because you suck at writing implies that you don't know how to write characters who aren't white.
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Valamyr on May 17, 2020, 12:57:03 am
I didn't read the whole thread but I recently played this and found it fairly disappointing, mainly on grounds of being ridiculously short. I knew I was getting a graphic novel and I'm fine with that format but it ends ridiculously abruptly in a railroaded fashion. This makes replay value just about nil save for seeing different companions. They got the overall theme and vibe right, but that's about it. Feels like you're only playing chapter 1 of a book, really. 
Title: Re: Vampire: The Masquerade – Coteries of New York / Third Vampire Game!!!
Post by: Nanaloma on May 17, 2020, 02:03:01 am
When I was young, we had a saying, "grow up!".  The world is not a nice place.  People need to thicken their skin.  If everyone got ballistic about such things, nobody would be able to work together.  The world will never be perfect especially since there is no agreement whatsoever on what would be a perfect world.  It's self-centered to think a group should make their world into their narrow view of perfect.  There's no need for additional warnings.  If you buy a game as soon as it is published, then you may be negatively surprised in multiple ways.  If you are sensitive, then wait until the bugs are out and the game is known on forums and reviews to buy.  That will warn you.   There are a lot of things I didn't like in VMBL1 but I ignored these because I enjoyed playing the game.  I think the key is, if enough things offend you, don't buy the game.  This was a "mature" rated game and that alone makes the audience a clique.  We like the roughness, the grittiness, etc - features that keep away a large audience and the lack of which often keeps us away.  If this game doesn't offend some people, it won't sell. 
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